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Thursday, 22nd March, 2012.

The Senate met at Half past Two o'clock p.m.



(MADAM PRESIDENT in the Chair)





MADAM PRESIDENT: I have to inform hon. senators that there is an error on the Order Paper, the line and date at the end of Questions With Notice and before Orders of the Day and Notices of Motions should be deleted.


MADAM PRESIDENT: I have to remind hon. senators to


switch off their cellphones before the commencement of business or put them on silent.


SENATOR MUMVURI: Thank you Madam President, I want to thank the Ministers who are here to respond to our questions. My question is directed to the Minister of Youth Development, Indigenisation and Empowerment. Can the Minister appraise us, of some of the successes of indigenisation programmes regarding to the monies which are being disbursed for the youth which they are collecting from the banks and if they can tell us the challenges they are meeting and the areas which they have covered so far?

THE MINISTER OF YOUTH DEVELOPMENT, INDIGENISATION AND EMPOWERMENT (MR. KASUKUWERE): Madam Speaker, I want to thank the hon. senator for his question. We have been able to put together a US$10m facility with Old Mutual Insurance Giants, these funds are basically secured by two and half percent share holding that we seeded to the young people of this country through the Zimbabwe Youth Council. The two and a half percent secured a facility of about US$10m with CABS and we did apportion about US$1m do be disbursed to young people throughout the country to all the provinces. If you take into account all the provinces you can work out what will each district get.

I am pleased to say that we have started to see some serious movements in terms of the disbursement of the funds. Initially there were some bottlenecks and challenges because the CABS system had not anticipated the number of young people who would apply. In terms of statistics over 3000 young people did apply for this facility to CABS and the bank did not have enough manpower to handle all these application. In the report that I got this morning now they have employed over 12 people, there is a full unit complemented by our officials in the Ministry who are now helping CABS to disburse these funds. Today over 200 young people have now received the monies and this is across all the provinces.

What happens is, young people lodge their application with the nearest CABS office and it is then processed through the system and who ever, has a good project, are then funded. We are now in the process of finalising another US$20m facility with Stanbic and I am sure that we will be able to make announcements at the appropriate time and this will go a long way in empowering our young people. This will cater for projects to a maximum of US$50 000 unlike the CABS facility which has a maximum of US$5 000

to allow for more young people to participate. We already have another facility with the CBZ and this is out of our annually support through the fiscus of about US$2.5m and this is already in circulation, young people have already been taking these funds. There have been a lot of successful projects being run by young people. What is encouraging is the type of quality and sectors our young people are going into, just looking at the statistics over 60% of the funds we are making available are going into manufacturing sector, agriculture, tourism and so on. The preponderance of young people is to go into the manufacturing sector (value addition) and we are heading for better hays in terms of the country.

SENATOR CHITAKA: My supplementary question to the Hon. Minister of Youth Development, Indigenisation and Empowerment is, can he give us a bit of insight into this organisation called Zimbabwe Youth Council (ZYC). Is it a statutory body, an NGO or it is a quasi-political organisation? We need to know exactly how they are appointed. We read about it, but we do not know about it.

MADAM PRESIDENT: Supplementary questions come from the responses given. Can you make a supplementary question not an original question.

SENATOR CHITAKA: Yes, he spoke about it. In his report, he mentioned the Zimbabwe Youth Council issue. It is a supplementary question because he has mentioned a very specific issue. I think I am still within my rights Madam President.

MR. KASUKUWERE: I want to thank you once again Senator Chitaka. It is a statutory institution born out of the Zimbabwe Youth Association and we have it in terms of our legislation. It is a board composed of six young people from various fields of endeavour. They choose their own people. For the past two weeks, they chose their people and some of the people are selected by the Minister. This time we advertised in the media and we received about 230 applications from young people who wanted to serve in the board. We set up a board and they chose qualified young doctors, engineers, accountants and so on. We have finished the process of putting a new board, but the way it is done is always to ensure that we can bring together all those various youth organisations. It is not a quasi-political organization. It is a Government institutions, a Government organ.

SENATOR KOMICHI: Thank you Madam President. I would like to pose a question...

MADAMA PRESIDENT: It is not a supplementary question?

SENATOR KOMICHI: Yes. I would like to hear from the Minister of Indigenisation how does it work and what are the benefits of the Community Share Ownership Trust Programme?

THE MINISTER OF YOUTH DEVELOPMENT, INDIGENISATION AND EMPOWERMENT (MR. KASUKUWERE): Thank you Madam President, I would like to thank Senator Komichi for his question. It was designed to achieve broad based empowerment. We have to take into account people in communities where resources are extracted. For a very long time, members of the communities have been looking on and watching their resources being taken out of their communities as they remained in poverty.

We saw it necessary, and we put the Indigenisation Statutory Instrument to allow for communities where resources are, to benefit from the extraction and from whatever is being mined in their areas.

What we did was to put together the Community Share Ownership Trust to be managed by the Chiefs. The Chiefs play a critical role in our societies. They are the ones with the people responsibly like the Zunde Ramambo and their historical background can tell. They lead the communities and they do that on behalf of their communities and their people.

Secondly, we ensured that the local authorities are also included in the trust like Rural District Councils because these are the major authorities in planning and they know the geographical order and the homogeneity of the people in the geographical area. We applied a much more decentralised and transparent system that will see our communities benefiting in the process.

I will give you an example of three Share Community Trusts that were put in place and tomorrow we are traveling to Gwanda. There is Zvimba, Chegutu and Ngezi where we have the Community Share Ownership Trust. We feel this is good for the communities to come together and get the seed capital. This will see them developing their communities in terms of education, water, hospitals and key infrastructural requirements necessary for the day to day running of the community.

We did that at Zvishavane and Shurugwi-Tongogara Community and the Tongogara Rural District Council. In Zvishavane, they are already building schools. This allows for the community people to benefit from the process of empowerment. We feel this was one of the of the best ways of the broad based empowerment as opposed to narrow based empowerment.

SENATOR HLALO: Thank you Madam President, I was going to ask the Minister. I heard the Minister saying that he is coming to Matabeleland South. I am interested to know when we are going to have a Community Trust Share Scheme in Umzingwane where we have one of the biggest mine which is Howe Mine.

MR. KASUKUWERE : Yes indeed we are moving into Matabeleland South Province to look into Gwanda. The Governor and the Provincial Administrator have been looking into that, to look into the planning process, to see if they can not do more work as well as perhaps get our Senators and Parliamentarians to become more aware of these Community Trust, how they set up and what is contained in the deeds of trust. Thank you Madam President.

SENATOR CHITAKA: Thank you Madam President, I wanted to ask the Minister for Youth Development, Indigenisation and Empowerment, I heard him talk about the board that is composed of 250 youths. I wanted to find out if there was any consideration of gender on that and if so, what is the ratio like?

MR. KASUKUWERE: Thank you Madam President I want to thank the senator for his question. Yes the 200 are those who applied to be considered and I want to say that it was very encouraging because the quality and standard of education of most of the young people was high.

In terms of gender we have taken that into account, it is almost on a 50/50 basis. The board will be composed of about 15, meaning it might be 8 girls and seven young man or vice-versa, but I can assure you that we will make sure that the gender representation is equal. However, we have gone further than that, we have got the disabled, we are bringing on board a very young prominent lawyer who is disabled and blind. We have also gone to look for the Vasope. So it is a very inclusive board, we are looking at the various provinces some of the tribes which have been forgotten. We want to bring them on board so that at least they can sit as mirrors of their societies and speak to government about challenges facing young people in their various constituencies. Thank you.

SENATOR MUMVURI: Thank you Madam President, I want to ask the Minister, you have said 10% Share Trust is allocated to the locals. Is this percentage rate fixed or it differs from resource to resource? If it is fixed, do you think as a government you have seen it adequate that it satisfies the local community for its needs? Thank you.

MR. KASUKUWERE: Thank you Madam President, I want to thank Senator Mumvuri again for his question, yes indeed on the basis of values it might differ in terms of saying this is a bigger company. The other could be a gold mine and it could be smaller, but we felt it was necessary for us to have at least a standard benchmark to say the minimum of 10%. There are instances of course where we would want to see a bigger share being given to the community and whenever that occurs we do not hesitate to empower the ordinary people. The whole objective of this law is to empower and uplift masses of our people. So we believe, for instance I can give you an example of Matabeleland South, just Gwanda alone. There are over 27 mining companies in Gwanda, they might vary in terms of their worth, some are small and some are big. But as long as we have at least that portion which is brought into the community trust which can be used by the local authorities alongside their Chiefs to develop and uplift their people. I think that goes a long way in ensuring that, the people do benefit. There are areas where there is just one mine but it will be a very big mine. So the 10% allows us at least, to have at least a benchmark from where to start, depending on the negotiations, on how the communities also feel themselves, one can always increase them, there is no doubt about that. But we look at the minimum of 10%, we also look at the similar percentage for the workers and then we look at ourselves and the fund which must cover the entire country. Thank you Madam President.

*SENATOR CHIEF MUSARURWA: Thank you Madam President, for giving me this opportunity to make my contribution. Will the Minister kindly explain how the 10% on profit is calculated. I ask this question because we could have an instance where a company will declare its 10 % dividend after 20 years and claim to be making a loss in its operations. How exactly is the ten% dividend calculated?

*MR. KASUKUWERE: Thank you Senator Chief Musarurwa for asking such a pertinent question. My Ministry has introduced a system whereby the community elects a member to sit in the board of an organisation where decisions are made. This means the individual so elected should be faithful and avoid being corrupted by making false dividend declarations by the organisation. May I also point out that mining companies will not continue to do business if they are running at a loss. When we talk of the 51% as the representation of the indigenous versus the foreign representation also means that the bulk of the earnings will remain in the country. If they declare a loss in their operations we would like to know the quantity of their production. For instance they may be into gold mining, we know the average price of gold and we do not expect a company to continue its operations. According to the new regulations, companies will be expected to declare their dividends every six months. I may take the example of Banket mine, would like to know how much money they have earned in their operations so that the 51% is used in the development of the community and therefore these new regulations enable and empower us to keep track of financial status of companies.

*SENATOR KABAYANJIRI: Thank you Madam President, I would like to ask the Minister, since you are talking of development in the rural areas due to the natural resources, we realise that legislators in either House are also part of that community which is endowed with the natural resources. Are these legislators part of the board which run these organisations?

*MR. KASUKUWERE: Thank you Madam President. I also want to thank hon. senator. What we are looking at is, what the people who will be running the affairs will be doing. Therefore, we do not have to be referees and players at the same time. There should be division of labour. All we are doing is, we are giving direction of things to be done. We ask you to participate and give in ideas and you are ex-officio. As leaders, we want to be leading these places. Also as leaders, we are acting on the oversight on all these projects. So what we are saying is, at the moment we should not get into the board, we should leave people doing the business and run these businesses while we do oversight. Yes, I know of Chiefs who are very much involved in the development of the country. We Members of Parliament and Senators, have seen that we should increase our leadership and guidance so that we monitor those that fall under our leadership.

SENATOR RUGARA: Just to begin by saying it is refreshing to have such information, and to realise that the Minister himself is informed about what is going on in his ministry.

My question then is on the 10% community portion. I realise that this is a development fund and we realise that we are developing a country and not community. These minerals mostly are meant for the nation. Is there any mechanism for people in the communities where they are not endowed with the minerals? Is there any way to compensate them because it is a lose? The situation maybe that Community B is not getting anything while community A, is getting everything of the 10%. Is there anyway it can be leveled up for everyone in Zimbabwe? However, I appreciate that Community A where the mineral is based, has a larger share, but in trying to develop the nation we should look into that. My second question …...

MADAM PRESIDENT: Order, when you are putting a supplementary question you are not allowed to put more than one. Those are the regulations which you should know by now.

MR. KASUKUWERE: Thank you Madam President. I want to thank the Senator again for his first statement of congratulating the work we are doing as a ministry. Secondly, his question with regards to the community and the nation at large. I will try and elaborate for the benefit of our hon. senators. On the beneficiary system we have communities, we have workers and we have the entire nation to look after. We have set up the National Indigenisation and Economic Empowerment Fund which I would like to say is our national sovereign fund. Once we have allocated the 10% to the community, we endeavour to see a bigger chunk of the remaining balance after we have looked after the workers. We endeavour to see a bigger chunk being now in the national wealth fund which is our National Indigenisation and Economic Empowerment Fund.

We have taken care of the immediate interests of the community. We have also taken care of the workers who are providing the labour. This National Indigenisation and Economic Empowerment Fund is now our Sovereign Fund that looks after the entire country. It participates and supports development in the entire country. I will give you an example; some of the platinum mines we have been discussing, we have allocated as much as 30% to the national fund. We can use the national fund for more than one reason apart from storing or keeping the value for generations to come and for the present generation. It also gives the nation enough muscle to raise funds to develop our nation. Just the three or four structures we are discussing or implementing right now, will give our nation the muscle required to raise billions of dollars which we can now plough into areas like energy. We have shortages of electricity now and again, our economy cannot develop if we have these levels of energy which are unreliable. Hence we need to invest in energy, in infrastructure development, road construction and we want to invest in the rail development and also water, etcetera. The sovereign fund will now cater for the broad interest of people of Zimbabwe. Whatever we have done for the community, we must replicate that in areas where they might also not have platinum. So as the Ngezi, Mhondoro, Zvimba, Chegutu constituencies. We expect to see Dotito, Marirangwe, and all other places having a similar development pattern.

So the national fund, I want to say is a national equalizer. It is there to store the value on behalf of our people. Otherwise the communities can be better, but we do not want to create islands of prosperity and seas of poverty. So we decided to equalize that by setting up the National Indigenisation and Economic Empowerment Fund.

Secondly, its role also is to create capacity to fund the upliftment of our people. We have the youths and women including the disabled as key targets for empowerment and disadvantaged society. We expect to see some of the profits coming out of these ownership been ploughed or been used to uplift, help our people set up alternative industries and businesses. Whilst today we can be boasting about our diamonds and platinum, these will one day run out. When they run out, how do we look after the people of this country. We must therefore use these savings graciously and invest in our people. Allow our young people to go into the ICTs. Allow our young people to go into other fields of endeavor. Empower the women. Support education. That will then give us a long term sustainability in terms of national development.

SENATOR CHITAKA: I have got a question for the Minister of Science and Technology Development. Would the Minister explain the workings and modalities of the Research Development, Commercialisation Innovation Fund and how effective is this fund.

THE MINISTER OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY (PROF. DZINOTYIWEI): I sincerely must thank the hon. senator for that question. I do recognise that we focus extensively on technical issues and that sometimes they are not readily publicised. What has happened is that within the thrust of science and technology development since 2009, we have recognised that, it is vital, that we build the general scope of science and education; its education, the training of scholars, the researchers, finding new ideas, it is also important that we build an arm which devotes to supporting real challenges on the ground by commercialising results that are already available. So it is our intention to see how we can develop that new arm of commercialising results that are already available.

The fund has been under funded to a large extent but we got a significant amount last year. When we opened to the research institutions and research centres to say look, this is your opportunity now, to show that science means economic issues on the ground, it means money, we had more than a 100 applications. Out of them we chose 17 to be funded. We also recognised that because these are greenfield issues, it is not just mimic something that we know has been happening elsewhere. They are potential difficulties ahead. There is likelihood that they will need further funding. This is why we controlled the number to a small collection of projects. These projects range from projects that relate to energy issues. They range from projects to do with agricultural issues and water purification issues. I can give you an example, the most precise way of purifying water is at a nanolevel. Nanolevel means we are operating at more or less molecular level and our researchers at NUST have come up with a nano filter from clay. When you go to developed countries like Japan and Korea, they will show you a highly technical nano-filter based largely on plastic-like products, membrances whose characterisitcs are quite complicated. From our natural resources like clay we know that we can produce a nano filter. Therefore we want to support this programme to see to what extent they can commercialise it so that the processing for water in local authorities can use that kind of clay at nano level. We have a strong interest to find out if we can build a lot more of that commercialisation of research results.

Let me take advantage to explain that Zimbabwe has a remarkable capacity in terms of capacity. The major research here, SRDC for commercial, its couterpart in South Africa employees CSAR employees more than 2 000 people. The number of Zimbabeans we have at CSAR is bigger than three times the professionals we have at SRDC. These people are there but are not at home. We are trying to define ways in which we can have programmes happen at home. Those who can intitiate something to commercialise at home, then take advantage of people outside so that they can come home not physically but through collaboration. It is part of the commercialisation arm. If an idea cannot get the talent needed here, let us build collaboration with our Zimbabweans just next door. It is all part of the effort to build the role of science and technology in matters of technology.

Questions Without Notice were interrupted by MADAM PRESIDENT in terms of Standing Order No. 34.



First Order read: Adjourned debate on motion on the harsh climate conditions in Region V.

Question again proposed.


Motion put and agreed to.

Debate to resume: Tuesday, 27th March, 2012.



Second Order read: Adjourned debate on motion on the First Report of the Thematic Committee on Millenium Development Goals on the provision of education in resettled areas.

Question again proposed.

SENATOR CHIEF MUSARURWA: Thank you Madam President, for giving me this opportunity to add my voice on the debate based on the report on education in the re-settled areas. I would like to thank this Committee for the findings on satellite schools. But I would like to look at another and invite members of this Committee to visit my Constituency in Chivhu. The parents in these re-settled areas working hand in hand with their political leadership have built some very good schools and clinics. The parents were responsible for moulding bricks and supplying the labour needed on the construction projects whilst legislators and Chiefs were responsible for sourcing for roofing material. To date we have managed to construct seven institutions and therefore, let us not only look at the dark side of resettlement areas. There are some areas were parents have made the initiatives of creating a conducive atmosphere for the education of their children. We all know that Great Zimbabwe was not built in a day therefore, we plead with the Government to continue giving assistance in the construction of these schools for the benefit of children in the re-settlement areas. As legislators especially as Members of the Senate let us be both planers and implementers of developmental projects in our various constituencies. Madam President, that was my contribution that we should also look at the brighter side and not concentrate on the dark side we are the Government.

May I also take this opportunity to correct Senator Kabayanjiri on the contribution he made in the House. Senator Kabayanjiri spoke of the owner of the farm in which he was resettled. The hon. senator should be aware of the fact that he is the owner of that property, the person he is referring to as the owner has grabbed that piece of land from Senator Kabayanjiri's ancestors and what the senator has simply done is repossessing what is rightfully his.

May I also take this opportunity to thank the Minister of Youth and Indiginisation Hon. Kasukuwere for spearheading the process of empowering Zimbabweans in re-possessing their wealth which had been grabbed by white settlers from our ancestors I would like to thank you very much please do not tire in your endeavors on the indigenisation programme.

MADAM PRESIDENT: Thank you Hon. Chief Musarurwa, for enlightening us and giving us the other side of the coin. We had been looking at the negatives on the satellite schools in the re-settlement areas but you have shown us the bright side were resettled farmers have pulled their resources to construct schools for their children. Is there any further debate on this motion, Minister?


Motion put and agreed to.

Debate to resume : Tuesday 27th March, 2012.



Third Order read: Adjourned debate on motion on the First Report of the Thematic Committee on HIV and AIDS on the Anti-Retroviral Therapy Roll Out Programme.

Question again proposed.


Motion put and agreed to.

Debate to resume: Tuesday 27th March, 2012.



Fourth Order read: Adjourned debate on motion on the partisan nature of the media in Zimbabwe.

Question again proposed.

SENATOR KOMICHI: Thank you Madam President, I would like to take this opportunity to express my sincere gratitude to all those who contributed on this motion.

There was viable debate on the various aspects of the motion and it is really plausible. It is probably one of the areas which many members in the first place were uninterested in debating about. Some people did not agree but later on the Senate became one and contributed very positively towards this motion.

I would like to thank Members of this Senate who also presided over this debate. To recap the few issues that were in this motion; (a) the composition of the Broadcasting Authority of Zimbabwe (BAZ), (b)The partisan nature of the public media in Zimbabwe against the social responsibility of the media role and the fundamental base for principles of democracy and citizens' constitutional rights law regionally and internationally, ( c ) the media's failure to take the form of the political and social structure within which it operates, (d) scrapping of laws like AIPPA and selective application of local instruments targeting journalists in the Media Houses.

These were the highlights and man and women managed to see these and encouraged the media to be fair to ensure that we promote unity. Broadcasting should go as a unifying national voice. I now move that the Senate adopts this motion.

Motion put and agreed to.

On the motion of THE MINISTER OF YOUTH DEVELOPMENT, INDIGENISATION AND EMPOWERMENT , the House adjourned at Twenty Seven Minutes to Four o'clock p.m. until Tuesday, 27th March, 2012.


Last modified on Tuesday, 19 November 2013 08:41
Senate Hansard Vol. 21 SENATE HANSARD - 22 MARCH 2012 VOL. 21 NO. 24