• Version
• Download 40
• File Size 456.18 KB
• File Count 1
• Create Date September 11, 2024
• Last Updated September 11, 2024

NATIONAL ASSEMBLY HANSARD 11 SEPTEMBER 2024 Vol. 50 No. 81

PARLIAMENT OF ZIMBABWE

Wednesday, 11^th September, 2024

The National Assembly met at a Quarter-past Two o’clock p.m.

PRAYERS

(THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair)

ANNOUNCEMENTS BY THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER

WORKSHOP ON HIV/AIDS

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I wish to inform the House that the National Aids Council (NAC) and its partners will conduct a sensitisation workshop on HIV and AIDS on Friday, 13^th September, 2024, starting at 0830 hours, in the Multi-Purpose Hall, New Parliament Building. During the workshop, NAC and its partners will provide free medical services such as screening for cervical and prostate cancer, high blood pressure, diabetes, HIV and AIDS and family planning services to interested Hon. Members. Accordingly, all Hon. Members are invited to attend this important workshop.

VISITORS IN THE SPEAKER’S GALLERY

         THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I wish to inform this House that we have received an11 Member delegation from the Parliament of Namibia, the Standing Committee on Home Affairs, Security, Constitutional and Legal Affairs headed by Hon. John Likando who is in the country for a study visit. The purpose of their visit is to understand the following: management of War Veterans Affairs in Zimbabwe, law reform initiatives and an overview of the Zimbabwe judicial system in general.

         You are welcome Hon. Members – [HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear.]-

APOLOGIES RECEIVED FROM MINISTERS

         THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I have received apologies from the following Ministers and Deputy Ministers: Hon. C. Sanyatwe, the Deputy Minister of Home Affairs and Cultural Heritage, Hon. D Phuti, the Deputy Minister of Information Communication Technology, Postal and Courier Services, Hon. W. Chitando, the Minister of Mines and Mining Development, Hon. Prof Murwira the Minster of Higher and Tertiary Education, Innovation, Science and Technology Development, Hon. M. M. Ndlovu, the Minister of Industry and Commerce, Hon. D. Marapira, the Deputy Minister of Lands, Agriculture, Fisheries, Water and Rural Development, Hon. Dr. Mombeshora, the Minister of Health and Child Care.

ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

         *HON. NHARI: I want to direct my question to the Minister of Health and Child Care. What plans does Government have to prevent the transmission of MPox?

         *THE MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AND INFRASTRUCTURE DEVELOPMENT (HON. MHONA): I want to thank Hon. Nhari for that pertinent question. Indeed, as a nation, we are troubled and concerned because of such pandemics which affect both our visitors and residents. As Government, we are monitoring all our entry points like airports and border posts. We have health professionals who are there to ascertain whether people have high temperature or not in order to screen. We do not have such a problem of Mpox in Zimbabwe. Let me urge the nation that people should not tarnish the image of Zimbabwe because some people are taking images from other countries and alluding them to what is happening in Zimbabwe, yet the situation on the ground is that there is not even a single case of anyone who has contracted Mpox in Zimbabwe, but we need to be vigilant. I thank you.

         *HON. P. ZHOU: Thank you very much Madam Speaker. Let me say that we need to look at our state of preparedness as a nation. Do we have the vaccines? Do we have the medicines to contain the pandemic if it comes because once bitten, twice shy? We experienced this during COVID-19 and then we noted that Government was really prepared? So, in this case, are we prepared?

         *HON. MHONA: May you indulge me, the leader of Government Business is in the House, but I am going to respond before handing over. It is true, Zimbabwe is a nation where people brainstorm about issues. When we face a challenge, we come together as a nation. So, when we were facing COVID-19, we did that, even as we face the challenge of Mpox which is affecting other countries, I believe that the Ministry of Health and Child Care would do the same. I want to assure the nation that we were informed during our Cabinet meeting that Government is prepared to fight this pandemic. I thank you.

          *HON. MATSUNGA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. I want to direct this question to the Hon. Minister saying that so far from what we have heard, what steps have you taken in terms of educating the nation so that we have adequate information? You are aware that schools opened yesterday, how are schools preparing their children so that children will be safe?

         *HON. MHONA: Thank you. I was acting but I am going to respond to the question. I want to thank the Hon. Member for that supplementary question. As a nation, we need to prepare our school children for such, but from the Minister of Health and Child Care’s statement, the ports of entry are the ones that the Ministry is focusing on mostly, so that the pandemic is not transferred or it is not imported into the country. There is modern equipment that is used at the border post to screen people. So, we are not resting, but we want to make sure that we prevent the transmission of this disease. Schools should have hotlines or they should have access to hotlines so that they inform the Minister of Health and Child Care. I thank you.

         *HON. KARIMATSENGA-NYAMUPINGA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. My supplementary is, how far has Government gone with the awareness campaign on this pandemic in terms of educating the nation so that people know the symptoms and the signs of the disease, whether they are in urban areas or in rural areas because I do not just want to focus on the transmission, but I want to focus on public education or public awareness campaigns? I thank you.

         *HON. MHONA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. I want to thank Hon. Nyamupinga. It is true because it is important for people to be informed. For people to be informed, there must be dissemination of such information. I believe that the people are watching and it is quite important for Government to disseminate information regarding this pandemic so that healthcare providers like clinics and hospitals have access to that information. They are carrying that information to the people. So, it is important to continue educating the nation and I am going to take these messages to the Hon. Minister of Health and Child Care so that the dissemination of information continues. I thank you.

         HON. MUROMBEDZI: Supplementary! Point of privilege Hon. Speaker Ma’am.

         THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Members, we have taken enough supplementary questions. We cannot take any point of privileges because if anything that we are going to raise is with regards to Mpox, please take a seat.

         HON. MUROMBEDZI: I am asking for a point of privilege to ask the Minister for a ministerial statement with regards to the topic that we are debating on Mpox because this is a topical issue and we would like the nation to know the preparedness of the country. It is imperative that this House and the nation is informed about the current state of Mpox, the Government’s preparedness, public awareness campaigns and the availability of vaccines and treatment process in the event that this disease has been found in Zimbabwe. So, we request for a ministerial statement from the Minister of Health and Child Care. Thank you.

         HON. MHURI: Good afternoon Madam Speaker Ma’am. My question is directed to the Minister of Transport and Infrastructural Development. Let me first of all acknowledge the good works which we are witnessing in Zimbabwe, especially with our road network. Indeed, we are approaching Canaan way before 2030. My question seeks clarity from the Minister with regards to the period of defects reliability, especially after the contractor has rehabilitated and reconstructed the road and handed it over to the Government. What is the period of defects reliability? I thank you.

         THE MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AND INFRASTRUCTURAL DEVELOPMENT (HON. MHONA): Thank you Hon. Madam Speaker Ma’am.  Let me also thank Hon. Mhuri for that very important question and also to appraise the august House that indeed, contractually, it is a 12-month period which is standard in any given contract.  I want to say we have been advocating for moral suasion where we will persuade our contractors to continue. However, we will not just ask them to continue monitoring the works but we will then have a contractual obligation for a minimum period of five years so that they continue maintaining our roads.  However, we are not mandating contractors to say they have handed over the road, you then give to the beneficial user and maintain it for five years.  We are saying 12 months, we do not pay anything if there are defects, which is the defects liability.  After the 12 months, we are also supposed to maintain but we will not tolerate a road – if you re-construct a road, we are guaranteed that we want 20 years and above without defects for a new road.  So there is no way a contractor can put up works and then at the end of the day, say yes, I have just gone through the 12 months and I am not accountable.  We will take to account and we are there to superintend over the resources of the fiscus and be accountable to the citizenry.  We will not allow contractors who come and do shoddy works and then hide on the liability defects of 12 months.  I thank you.

         HON. MHURI: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  My supplementary question pertains to the issue that we have certain roads like the urban roads which are being re-constructed by local authorities.  These local authorities fall under another Ministry, which is not the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructural Development. I want to check the Government policy with regards to maintaining these roads which we are witnessing right now, so that at least we can have a reasonable period where these roads are in good shape.  I thank you.

         HON. MHONA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  Let me also thank Hon. Mhuri.  All roads fall under the purview of the Ministry of Transport but we have got road authorities.  We also have cited local authorities, Rural District Councils (RDCs), Department of Roads and Ridder, which was known as DDF.  In terms of maintaining roads, for urban roads, it is under the mandate of the local authorities.  Even if we rehabilitate a road, as a Ministry, we will still handover the road to the local authority so that they manage the road.  I want to concur with the Hon. Member that yes, even if the road is done by a local authority, we also make sure that we monitor from the Ministry so that the road is still sound and trafficable and we take to account the local authority.  At the end of the day in terms of monitoring, in terms of disbursements as we know that funding will be coming through ZINARA, we will say at the end of the day, local authorities, RDCs and RIDA are still accountable to the Ministry.  If we go to the statutes, the Roads Act 13, Chapter 18 and in particular Section 5 of that particular Act, mandates the Minister of Transport to take the neglected roads, whether it is coming from a local authority or an RDC, so that we rehabilitate but handover to the road authority.  I thank you.

         HON. MADZIVANYIKA: Thank you Madam Speaker.  Coming to the issue of construction of roads and accountability, on average, how much does it cost to construct a 1 km road?  In light of the fact that social media is awash with posts that USD1.7 billion was used in the construction of roads during the run-up to the SADC Summit.  Thank you.

         HON. MHONA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  Let me thank my good brother who has given me the chance to articulate, given the falsehood, which is also my humble plea to the people of Zimbabwe, so that as we start circulating, let us have facts.  We have seen that something that is of fault is quick to spread like veldfire.  In this particular incident where reporters, reportedly said, he had actually engaged the Minister and I was not around.  I was mesmerised to say I have engaged the Minister and has confirmed figures.  I was then happy to say, within 24 hours of that statement, it was retracted, they agreed that yes, they had erred and they apologised.  I am saying so because USD1.7 billion – if this House is to give me USD1.7 billion, I will do wonders in terms of rehabilitating roads.  You will find that for someone to wake up and write a story that USD1.7 billion was used, I do not know.

         To answer my brother, on average, we are talking of USD1 million, 1.2 million to re-construct a new road.  If  I were to do your numbers to that USD1.7 billion, I was going to tar a number of cities, almost 50% of the provinces, they would be having new tarred roads.  Alas! That is not the correct position.  I want to again appeal to the Fourth State, as we report, let us not cause pandemonium, mayhem in our country by reporting something that is false.  I thank you.

         *HON. NYABANI: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  My question is that the Hon. Minister said that it will take an average of five years to rehabilitate a road, so the question is, the overload that is happening on our roads as a result of haulage trucks which are quite voluminous; are you noting that Hon. Minister?

         *HON. MHONA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  I would also like to thank Hon. Nyabani.  It is true, I want to appreciate the quite pertinent question.  The challenge we are noting is that there are some heavy loads which are plying our routes.  As a Ministry, we want to introduce way bridges from mines and from different areas.  These will assist us to ascertain the loads that pass through our roads.  If we do not do that, our roads are going to be destroyed.  As time goes, our plan is that we want to make sure our trucks will be moving goods from the pits to ports but we want to introduce goods trains, locomotives which will be carrying heavy loads.  Trucks will not be allowed to use our roads, instead loads should be taken from locomotives.  I thank you.

         HON. BONDA: Thank you Madam Speaker.  My question goes to the Minster of Environment.  Considering the statistics of elephants, which is sitting at 100 000 in numbers and has doubled the recommended eco-system balance in ratio against other habitants of the parks, which is also causing starvation and deaths of elephants; does the Government have any plans to reduce the numbers by culling and feeding the meat to the schools, prisons, communities starving due to drought induced by El nino as CITES does not block us from consuming our own God-given meat.

THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, CLIMATE AND WILDLIFE (HON. DR. S. NYONI):   Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. That is a pertinent question and I would like to thank the Hon. Member.  Indeed, Zimbabwe has more elephants than we need and more elephants than our forests can accommodate. We are having a discussion with Zim Parks and some communities to do like what Namibia has done, so that we can count the elephants, mobilise the women to maybe dry the meat and package it to ensure that it gets to some communities that need the protein.

The Ministry is working very hard to ensure that within the confines of the law, we can cull what is allowed for us to cull and be able to input into the Presidential feeding schemes to provide the protein. I want to thank the Member for that pertinent question. I thank you.

*HON. GWANGWABA: I want to direct my question to the Minister of Environment. Looking at the population of elephants in Zimbabwe, the human wildlife conflict is prevalent in most parks. What is Government doing to resolve the human wildlife conflict, where you find wild animals not having a good relationship with human beings? I thank you.

HON. S. NYONI: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. That again, is an important question from the Hon. Member. Indeed, the human wildlife conflict is rife in Zimbabwe. It usually causes lack of resources and like the other Member has asked, when there is over population of wildlife in a specific park. They will then seek to go outside the park to look for other resources such as water or greenery. When that happens, they will then come into contact with the humans and conflicts begin. The Hon. Member is correct in that elephants become very violent and in a lot of cases, there are some cases where they kill people.

 The Ministry is concerned about that as well as the Government. This is sometimes because people may be going out to fetch firewood or water without being aware of these animals coming into their terrain. Some of the cases may be accidental but part of it could be avoided by us as parks, erecting fences and making sure that animals do not move away from the parks.

In addition, making sure that within the parks, there is enough water so that animals do not get out. Some of the residents in the communities go into the parks for resources there. We need to make sure that there is a separation through using appropriate fences and also through making sure that water is available in the parks and in the communities so that people would not have to be going into the parks or animals coming into the community to find resources that do not exist where people and animals reside. I thank you Madam Speaker.

*HON. S. TSHUMA:   Thank you Madam Speaker. The Minister spoke about the culling of elephants culminating in the slaughtering of the elephants for the benefit of communities. What are the challenges in terms of implementing that because you find that some people in communities are facing hunger since elephants are destroying people’s gardens and other projects? Can the Minister inform the House what is delaying this process? I thank you.

HON. S. NYONI:  Thank you Madam Speaker. There are no delays at all. In fact, just yesterday, I wrote to Zim Parks to facilitate this process. So, the process is in progress. Thank you.

*HON. MAPIKI:  Thank you Madam Speaker. My question goes to the Minister of Environment. This is quite good information regarding the culling of elephants. Instead of relying on CITES, what is Government planning to do in terms of implementing this because there are 90 thousand ivory tusks. As a nation, what are we planning to do regarding the membership to CITES so that we are able to make our own sovereign decisions?  I thank you.

HON. DR. S. NYONI:  Madam Speaker, if Zimbabwe had a way, we would sell our elephants or our ivory like yesterday, but CITES is a Convention of many countries. We cannot make our own decisions. We have to negotiate. I think we are developing strong negotiators and lobbying other countries to make sure that when we go to CITES, they can come on our side. I think that is something that pains Zimbabwe because you will also find that the people who prevent us from selling our ivory are people who, like our President said, have already finished and killed off their own animals. They do not have elephants. They do not know what we are talking about. They do not have the experience of this human wildlife conflict that we are facing. Those are the people who influence the decision of CITES. It is a problem that Zimbabwe is facing but it is not only Zimbabwe, some other countries as well.

We will need to have strong lobby and hope that one day we will win to have our own way. There is a thinking that we should move out of CITES and do our own thing. Also, there are consequences for doing that. So, the debate Madam Speaker, goes on and I think the Hon. Member is correct. Zimbabwe would like to be independent and take charge of our own animals, but we cannot because we are part of the global village. I thank you.  

         *HON. KARIMATSENGA-NYAMUPINGA: Thank you, Madam Speaker Ma’am. I want to direct my question to the Minister of Public Service, Labour and Social Welfare. I want to know from the Minister, what are the Government plans for the disabled who live with cerebral palsy? These are people who are unable to do most activities especially young children. The question is that what does Government plans to do for such children, parents and those who are their guardians because they are not able to do anything for themselves. When you leave them in a certain position, you find them there. The question is what does the Government plan to do regarding them? I thank you.

         *THE MINISTER OF PUBLIC SERVICE, LABOUR AND SOCIAL WELFARE (HON. J. MOYO): Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. I want to thank the Hon. Member for that question which is quite pertinent. Those who are disabled have different conditions. Our Department profiles different people and with that database, there are categories which help us in assisting people in different ways according to their needs. Those who need assistance in terms of going to school, their parents might not be able to take care of them so Government looks at such issues when giving through the Social Protection Unit.

Situations are assessed differently.  I cannot mention the figures here but the Department looks at the particular needs of a disabled person, their families and their guardians. When distributing food aid through the food security programme, these are the people who are given first preference, the vulnerable. Some of the people who benefit from the food relief programme are given social assistance which is a fund which was created by Government and which is there whether there is drought or not. It is always there to deal with those who are in need but the challenge is that sometimes we might not have such information of people who have such needs and such people may not be able to come to our offices. I want to urge Members of Parliament who have such information to bring this information to our District offices, Provincial offices because we have Social Welfare offices in every district which are responsible for assisting those who are needy. These people might not be able to come to offices but we believe that Hon. Members with such information would provide such information. We urge Traditional leaders, our Chiefs, our Headmen and local leaders to provide such information. I thank you.

         *HON. KARIMATSENGA -NYAMUPINGA: Thank you, Hon. Minister for that answer. What I wanted clarity on is that I have a child with cerebral palsy and the child cannot do anything. I cannot leave my child but sometimes I am forced to lock the door which I do not want to do in order to fend for the other children so that they go to school. The question is that what are Government plans to support them because you find that parents sometimes are spending much time doing such chores. I thank you.

         HON. J. MOYO: Thank you, Madam Speaker Ma’am. Maybe I did not clarify properly for the Hon. Member or had a communication breakdown. The social welfare assistance is that there is need for testing which means that after assessing the severity of the disability, having seen that which results in the family suffering, social assistance is not just given to the child but to the family, the mother or the host family which is fending for such a child.  Madam Speaker, this takes away the income of the family as the guardians or parents spend time looking after the disabled.  So, the Ministry is quite clear on that when an Hon. Member or a person has such a need, they go to the Social Welfare offices and explain like the Hon. Member explains.  The Social Welfare assistance is given after looking at all the circumstances surrounding that particular case, not only the child but the whole family is assessed so that they are assisted.  I thank you.  

         *HON. KARENYI:  Thank you Madam Speaker.  The response that was given to the question that was asked by Hon. Nyamupinga looking at the challenges that are faced by such a parent - when a child is born the health authorities will be knowing that the child has a disability, is there any other way of creating a database of such unique cases? When you speak to those people you would find that some children are disabled and they are locked in doors, yet that information is not made public for Government to have such access. So the question is that is it not possible to create a database when that information is gotten after a child is born so that Government can assist.  I thank you.

         *HON. J. MOYO:  Thank you Madam Speaker. I want to thank the Member for that supplementary question.  Indeed, it is true that our offices might not have access to such information.  What is needed is the relation between the Ministry of Health and the Ministry of Public Service, Labour and Social Welfare regarding that issue.  What I know is that we have prepared, through the Ministry of Finance, working with other Ministries and other Departments like the World Bank and UNICEF, a database looking at how the disabled were disabled and if they were injured, how they got injured.  There should be such a database.  I might not know of every person in Zimbabwe who is facing a disability challenge but we are working in creating such a database.  I thank you.

         *HON. MUCHEMWA:  Thank you Hon. Minister for that responds.  I wanted to ask whether it is possible to create centres in districts and provinces where we come from, where such children can be intitutionalised so that families are given the opportunity to fend for the rest of the family.  I thank you.

         *HON. J. MOYO:  Thank you Madam Speaker.  We have a number of centres but there is alternative care of children.  In alternative care, we do not encourage people to separate children from their parents but they should be assisted as they live in normal homes with their parents.  If that does not happen, then they can be taken to institutions.  People who grow up in institutions are different from those who grow up in families where they have parents, whether they are foster parents or biological parents.  This is what we encourage people to do, for example, the case which was referred to by Hon. Nyamupinga.  For such a child to be taken to care services, they might not receive the same kind of care and love they get from their family.  We believe that it is better for children to be with their parents and in proper homes instead of being in institutions. I thank you.

*HON. MUSWEWESHIRI: Thank you Madam Speaker. My question is directed to the Minister of Health and Childcare.  What is the Government’s position with regards to the shortage of drugs, especially to those with mental challenges?  I thank you.

*THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF HEALTH AND CHILDCARE (HON. KWIDINI): I would like to thank the Hon. Member for the question on Government’s position on shortage of mental health drugs.  It is very true and we are aware, but I believe when we started having this problem as the Ministry and Government at large, we realised that most of these drugs are not locally manufactured.  So, as we speak, those drugs are on their way from the manufacturers.  So, the shortage problem has been addressed.  I thank you.

HON. J. TSHUMA: Thank you very much Madam Speaker.  My supplementary question is that talking about the drug shortage, what is Government’s position really, because some of these shortages are actually artificial?  The Doctors and nurses are opening pharmacies right next to hospitals and they are taking drugs that are supplied by Government and putting them in their own pharmacies and then sell to people who fail to get the drugs from hospitals.  So, what is Government’s position to try and make sure that doctors and nurses are not allowed to do such shenanigans because at the end of the day, Government is blamed for shortages that are artificial.  I thank you.

 HON. KWIDINI: Thank you Madam Speaker, for the supplementary question.  I would not want to say it is very true that doctors and nurses are taking medicines procured by Government to put in their pharmacies or their businesses. I am sure we are all aware, that here in Zimbabwe, if everyone maybe wants to open a business especially a pharmacy, for as long as he/she is meeting the requirements set by the authorities to run such kind of business, they have got the mandate to order drugs from where they are being sold.  But now as Government, we have seen that most of the drugs are not locally manufactured as I said earlier on.  That is why you have seen that Government is now trying to capacitate these local manufacturing companies so that the shortages of drugs will be reduced or eradicated. Currently, we have a huge consignment which is coming from our suppliers.  So, to tell the truth, maybe by mid-October, all these shortages of drugs we are discussing in here will have greatly improved. With time, when these local companies have full manufacturing capacity with the assistance of Government, all these shortages will be a thing of the past.  I thank you.

HON. MOLOKELA: Thank you Madam Speaker.  A follow up question, if you are expecting a huge consignment, there is an assumption that there has been some research in terms of the amount of medicines that are needed to address the shortage.  Can you give us more information on whether you did research in terms of the quantities to address the shortages?  I thank you.

HON. KWIDINI: Thank you Madam Speaker, for the follow up question. I think that question is now specific and it needs statistics and numbers.  What I know is that some of the drugs like the ones which originated the question of mental health drugs are the ones which we are facing challenges with.  However, in the Ministry, we have technical people who do the quantification and everything which gives actual figures and numbers of drugs which are needed per year by the Government or by the people in Zimbabwe.  I thank you.

*HON. MAPIKI: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  My question is, what is the Government’s plan regarding not just bringing medication, but knowledge.  In Zambia, you would find that they are using indigenous knowledge systems.  You find some taking medication from here and bringing it back as processed medicines.

*HON. KWIDINI: I want to start by thanking you Hon. Speaker Ma’am and I also want to thank the Hon. Member for that supplementary question.  We all know that as a country, at one point, we faced challenges but because of the wisdom of our leader His Excellency, who has a mantra that Zimbabwe is open for business, we want our local people to come up with innovative ideas through their companies and through research so that they can use indigenous knowledge systems.  We have qualified knowledgeable people who can use allopathic or traditional medicines which are known by our ancestors, our grandfathers and grandmothers who can take that knowledge and information to make it into modern medication through our qualified young people. I thank you.

*HON. MATSUNGA: My question goes to the Minister of Transport Hon. Mhona.  My question is, how far has Government gone in terms of fixing our railway lines, which will be beneficial for our businesses through the use of railway lines and also to avoid accidents that might happen as a result of these?  When you look at statistics regarding accidents, you would find that there are less accidents when using railway line.  So, the question is, how far has Government gone in doing that?  I thank you.

*THE MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AND INFRASTRUCTURE DEVELOPMENT (HON MHONA): I want to thank Hon. Matsunga for that pertinent question because this gives us the opportunity to clarify to the nation. I appreciate that she raised what our Ministry is seized with because we want to see things moving in the right direction. We cannot just reminisce of the past but as a Ministry, we are glad that we have plans to resuscitate our railway lines.

Last month, the railway companies of Botswana, Mozambique and Zimbabwe came together with a view to revive the Chikwalakwala Railway Line which goes via Dabuka to Plumtree and also the Beira-Machipanda Railway Line. What we are doing here regarding our railway lines are cushions which are potholes when it comes to roads. We have worked on quite a large stretch which means that we have covered 10% of the total length of our railway lines. We have engaged the Ministry of Finance and Economic Development and through China Railway, we engaged them where a number of agreements were mooted which will result in wagons coming in to Zimbabwe. This would help us in order to make sure we have trains which will be carrying people.

I want to assure the nation that we have towns like Ruwa, Norton and other peri-urban areas which are going to be serviced by railway lines in the near future. You will discover that the price of using trains will be cheaper than other public transport. I also want to say that people should take note that most of our railway lines are going to be up and running hence motorists must stop at railways crossings as a precautionary measure.

*HON. S. ZIYAMBI: I want to thank the Minister for the good work that is being done by Government. In the past, there were electric passenger trains and the world over there are bullet trains which are carrying people. I want to know what Government plans are regarding the introduction of electric trains from Bulawayo, Victoria Falls, Mutare, Harare and other major centres. I thank you.

*HON. MHONA: I want to thank Hon. Ziyambi for that question. He spoke about bullet trains, others used to talk about spaghetti roads and now we have spaghetti roads. I believe that everything has its own time and all things are possible when we work together. I want to say to the Hon. Member, local people are stealing electric cables. We used to have 330km of electric cables from Dabuka to Harare but these we stolen. I want to assure Hon. Ziyambi that the bullet trains are coming.

*HON. KASHAMBE: My question is directed to the Minister of Transport and Infrastructure Development. Before I pose my question, I want to appreciate the good work that you are doing in fulfilling the mandate that you were given by His Excellency, the President. My question is that what plans do you have regarding sign posts especially where children cross the road when going to school in urban areas?

*HON. MHONA:  I want to thank Hon. Kashambe who raised a very important question. Now that our roads have been rehabilitated this can act as a catalyst to accidents as motorists will be speeding. I want to say rest in peace to all those passengers who have been killed due to accidents on the roads. When we use our roads, we need to remember that we have to preserve people’s lives. In every neighbourhood where there are schools, we are going to introduce rumble strips. Such strips are found on all roads which are near schools. Where humps are necessary, we are going to do that. We do not want to put humps on every road but sometimes if it is going to protect and preserve people’s lives, then we are going to do that. I believe that Hon. Members in this august House who have information where there are no strips and humps should inform our Ministry so that we put danger warning signs to communicate this to drivers to exercise caution. Even for those who have livestock should make sure that their livestock do not stray into roads. It is important to fence around our farms so that our livestock do not stray into roads where they cause accidents.

In the past few months, we have lost a lot of relatives, friends and other people. This is quite sad. Last week on 1^st September and on 27^th August, we had serious accidents. On 27^th August, a bus which was travelling to South Africa from Bulawayo caused the death of a young family of three. Again, at Bromley along Mutare Road, we lost four children from one family. This is quite painful and it is sad. His Excellency the President, Dr. E. D. Mnangagwa, is quite concerned about such things. We do not want to make life difficult for people of Zimbabwe but when we put these strips, we do so in order to save human life. I thank you.

*HON. KASHAMBE: Thank you Hon. Speaker for that satisfactory answer. I want to pose a supplementary question saying that you promised that you are going to move the Skyline tollgate from within the community and Dema tollgate from within the community. I want to ask how far this project has gone?

*HON. MHONA: Thank you Hon. Speaker and thank you Hon. Kashambe for this opportunity to inform the nation of the progress. Indeed, when these tollgates were built, there were no homes and residential areas around the tollgate areas. My plea is that as we build our houses, when we continue moving tollgates, we will end up not having tollgates because people are building through the urban sprawl. They are just spreading outside the cities. We are in the process of moving the tollgate to the Charter grid which is 40 kms from the City of Harare.

So, we are going to move the tollgates. Those who are in Ushewokunze, Southlea Park and other areas will be able to travel without going through the tollgate and the Dema tollgate is also going to be moved towards the Mabhawua area. Those who are in Chitungwiza and Dema would also be free moving to their homes. The other tollgate we intended to move, especially in Mashonaland Central to the Henderson Research, we are no longer taking it to the Henderson Research but to the Mvurwi turn off. This means those who are in Mazowe and other areas will not be facing that challenge. This is not going to be the end of it but always when we see that there is a challenge with tollgates, we will be reviewing because this is a Government of the people. I thank you.

*HON. MASHONGANYIKA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. I want to thank the Ministry of Transport for the good work that they are doing. However, I want to say that in the capital city which is where everyone converges from the rest of the provinces, that is where most accidents are happening and losing lives, my question is, what is Government planning to do with commuter omnibuses which do not have proper termini so there must be termini for commuter omnibuses, even for small cars? I thank you.

THE MINSITER OF TRANSPORT AND INFRASTCUTURAL DEVLOPMENT (HON. MHONA):  Thank you Hon. Mashonganyika for that question. I have heard that sometimes challenges which are given to the Ministry of Transport are not necessarily our problems, but I am not here to put parameters. Let me say that in cities, there are local authorities which are responsible for ranks and termini, as the Hon. Member has said, Local Government and municipal authorities. In other areas, there are district council offices which are responsible for that. So, Ministry of Local Government is responsible for making sure that people know where they are supposed to rank and other things. As Government, we will continue going to continue working on that. I thank you. 

*HON. GANYIWA: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. My supplementary question to the Minister of Transport pertains to the state of our roads. Looking at the round abouts, there are some which we have seen which are a bit congested. When people enter into round abouts, you find two cars coming from the same direction, the other on the right and the other on the left. These cars do not have enough space to maneuver. If there are haulage trucks as an example, when coming into Chivhu, some haulage trucks overturn. They will be carrying heavy loads and they are not given enough latitude to negotiate the roundabout…

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What is your question Hon. Member?

*HON. GANYIWA: My question is that is there…

*HON. MASHONGANYIKA: On a point of order Hon. Speaker Ma’am.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What is your point of order Hon. Mashonganyika?

HON. MASHONGANYIKA: My point of order is that we are allowing people to communicate in local languages. You find Hon. Members laughing when people speak deep vernacular. This is what I just wanted to say.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you Hon. Mashonganyika. Next time allow the Hon. Member to continue instead of interfering whilst he is trying to express himself. Hon. Ganyiwa, you had not asked your question, but I had seen that your question should be put into writing so that the Hon. Minister would look at that specific question in order to prepare his response and bring it to the august House. I thank you.

HON. MAPFUMO: Good afternoon Madam Speaker Ma’am. My question is directed to the Minister of Energy and Power Development. With Kariba Dam almost at a dead storage and Hwange not being capacitated enough to meet demand.  What plans do you have as a Ministry to mitigate power outage in productive sectors with agriculture in particular, considering the drought and adverse effects of climate change in order to keep our grain reserves up and avert hunger through uninterrupted irrigation? I thank you.

THE MINISTER OF ENERGY AND POWER DEVELOPMENT (HON. E. MOYO): Thank you Madam Speaker and thank you Hon. Member for that pertinent question. Indeed, Kariba Dam has run very low, but we continue to generate at a minimum up to the end of the year. The specific question is what we are doing to mitigate this serious power outages that we are facing in the country. First of all, we are working on the Hwange Units 1 to 6, to repower them and we are doing one unit at a time. We are also quoting some funding partners so that we repower the whole station units 1 to 6, so that we can raise their generation capacity from the current average 350 megawatts to about 840 megawatts.

In the immediate term and specifically to agriculture, we have already set aside for the winter wheat crop, initially 100 megawatts. It was ringfenced for that purpose. However, with the demand for power and irrigation increasing as the crop was growing, we further gave them 50 megawatts, in addition and making ringfenced power to 150 megawatts.  The other thing that we had done to also release power for critical uses is that 20% of our power is going to the mining sector, specifically the Ferrochrome.  We have asked them to do their own generation plants, which timeframe, we have given up to the end of 2025.  Most of them are already working on their own power plants and most of them on renewable energies, specifically solar.

         We are also not just banking on releasing power from the mining sector, we are also working on a solution for farmers so that farmers get solar specific systems for their farms.  Negotiations are going on with different funding partners and opportunities are quite high that we will succeed so that such farmers can then be listed on that programme.  They can then get the solar system to power their farms.  It is going to help them because it is going to come at a lower cost than they are buying from the current arrangement.  I thank you.

         HON. MAPFUMO: Thank you Hon. Minister for your response.  Madam Speaker Ma’am, the issue of power was before this House, I think two months ago.  However, we are still having a challenge.  I humbly request if there is a turnaround time regarding the independent solar capacity session for farmers to have separate grids regarding the solar?  I thank you.

         HON. E. MOYO: Thank you very much Madam Speaker.  I would like to thank Hon. Mapfumo for that supplementary question.  On the issue of timeframe, I would not want to tie myself for specific timeframe.  I want to say negotiations with possible partners in that regard have already commenced.  We are hopeful that may be by end of the year- beginning of next year, something tangible would have come up.  However, we are also experiencing a bit of increase in power generation, with the coming in of the independent power producers.  Just last week, Zimplats brought in their power, 35 megawatts onto the stream.  We also have several other plants which are going to be on screen before the end of the year.  We anticipate that from independent power producers, new power by the end of the year, we should be having about 140 megawatts, additional power to the current power that we have.  Thank you.

HON. MAMOMBE: Thank you very much Madam Speaker Ma’am.  We know that the Hwange Power Station was being funded by China.  The Government of China has since announced that it is not going to be funding any non-renewable energy sources across Africa or in any parts of the world, in light of the climate change issues.  This is because China is also doing its nationally determined contributions, where they are moving to renewable energy sources.  My question is do we have a plan to be investing in renewable energy sources, instead of focusing on the Hwange Power Station.  Secondly…

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Mamombe, you can only ask one question. Thank you.

HON. MAMOMBE: So, my question is in light of funding, can the Hon. Minister highlight in this House if we have any prospects of funding the expansion of the Hwange Power Station?  I thank you.

HON. E. MOYO: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  I would like to thank Hon. Mamombe for the question.  The first part of the question speaks to the funding of Hwange, which is done by the Chinese, which is very true.  Also, that there has been an announcement by China that they are not going to be funding any further thermal projects.  Well, I cannot confirm at the moment but there has been talk and I think internationally.  The direction is that people are going renewable.  I think most funding partners are looking at that direction.  However, our sources of funding are not limited to one country or jurisdiction.  We have various and in fact, we have had many people, prospective funders who have come to the country on thermal.  We are signing a lot of MOUs.  A lot of ground work and feasibility studies are around thermal.  So, the channel of thermal is not completely closed, also we would want to migrate from thermal to renewable.  I think to our best knowledge, thermal has been very trustworthy and this is why our situation is much better than some of our neighbours because of thermal.

Coming to plans for renewable, we have a lot of plans.  The first one is that we opened up the energy space for independent power producers so that private players can come in and do the work. Indeed, there are a lot of projects which are coming up, which are being done by independent power producers on the renewable space.  We also have floating solars that are being proposed.  Some of them which are going to be done by Zimbabweans and other floating solar prospects are coming through the Zambezi River Authority, which boldly manages our Zambezi River on behalf of both the contracting parties, which is Zimbabwe and Zambia.  In that space, the Zambezi River Authority is partnering with the African Development Bank and they are working on a feasibility study on that floating solar project.

There is also, which I think is perhaps in the medium to long term, the Batoka project, whose feasibility study is being updated.  Also, perhaps flighting of tenders for people who may be interested in developing that area.  In terms of renewable sources, we are also looking at wind prospects.  Wind profiling sites have been identified and work is going on.  The mast which does the capture of the wind density is currently being done and normally it takes about 18 months.  I know about two sites are going to have their results by end of this year.  So, our prospects are quite high.  Most of them of course, in the medium term.  I thank you.

HON. DR. KHUPE: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  I would like to supplement by complimenting the question raised by Hon. Mapfumo on energy because energy is a key enabler in economic development. What is Government doing about the Lupane-Lubimbi Methane Gas Project, which was given a national project status in 2007?  According to findings, Zimbabwe has 40 trillion cubic feet of potentially recoverable methane gas, which has a capacity of generating about 6 000 megawatts, which is more than enough for Zimbabwe. We can export the excess to other countries and make sure that our revenue increases.  What is Government doing about that?  My question is motivated by the current problems that we are facing in regards to energy.  I thank you.

HON. E. MOYO: Thank you much Madam Speaker and thank you very much to the Hon. Member for the question. Lupane Methane Gas is available but there are no investors to take up that investment. It is available. Studies were carried out and it was confirmed that it is there. I am sure at some point tenders were flighted for people who would want to invest in that area. Some people indicated interests, but I understand that later on their interests fizzled out. We are waiting for any prospective investors who might be interested because the resource is available. I thank you.

HON. CHIGUMBU: On a point of privilege, Madam Speaker.

HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What is your point of privilege?

* HON. CHIGUMBU:  My point of privilege is that last week, a certain question was posed to the Minister of Energy and Power Development, in his absence, the Leader of Government Business, the Minister of Transport answered that question that he was going to have a discussion with the Minister of Energy and Power Development.  Since he is in the House, may he answer that question?

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  You may simply ask the question and then it will be answered. Let the question be asked and later, it will be answered.

* HON. CHIGUMBU:  I am not on today’s list.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  Please, talk to your Chief Whip to assist you.

HON. CHIGUMBU: Thank you Madam Speaker.

HON. NYATHI: Thank you Madam Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister of Social Welfare. I would like to find out what is delaying the roll out of the Government assistance in urban areas, particularly in Bulawayo.  The programme is still ongoing and we have been talking about this for over three months now. People are really struggling to make ends meet, to put food on the table. Can the Minister update us and when this programme is expected to start particularly, in urban areas? Thank you.

THE MINISTER OF PUBLIC SERVICE, LABOUR AND SOCIAL WELFARE (HON. J. MOYO): Thank you Madam Speaker, may I seek your indulgence so that I can correctly understand what the Hon. Member is saying.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  Hon. Nyathi, please may you ask your question again.

*HON. NYATHI:  Let me ask in Shona so that you will understand.  When is the drought relief programme beneficiaries going to benefit in the urban cities? Schools have now been opened and parents are now starving but in other areas, the programme has started. Why has there been a delay in carrying out this programme in urban centres? When is it going to be starting? Thank you.

*THE MINISTER OF PUBLIC SERVICE, LABOUR AND SOCIAL WELFARE (HON. J. MOYO):  Thank you Madam Speaker. I would want to thank the Hon. Member for the question that pertains to urban centres. In urban centres, when the research was carried out, the number of people that were vulnerable was 1. 7 million. They have observed that there are more than 1. 7 million in the cities. We held a workshop in Bulawayo and brain stormed in order to come up with 1. 7 million inhabitants of cities that have more than six million people.

We then came up with committees of residents in each ward. The wards in each city are more. In the rural areas there are 1 620 wards out of 1590. Those in the cities are the ones that we inquired into and were informed by Zimbabwe Livelihood Assessment Council (ZIMLAC). They sat down and informed us of the numbers of the percentage of each ward that was allocated to each ward. Those that are entitled to food assistance is 5% of 50% or 60%.

We go to these committees and tell them there are three thousand people and of the three thousand people, we want 5% whom we can give food aid. Cumulatively, the figure will add up to 1. 7 million. This was difficult and it is different from what is in the rural areas. In the rural areas, we asked the headmen, chiefs and village heads numbering 35 thousand, to sit down come up with the people that are facing starvation. It is easy in the communal lands because it is self-evident that the crops wilted. They did not harvest anything. They do not have any cattle. In the urban centres, it requires one to be patient to carry out this exercise. Hence, it has taken longer for us to conclude this.

If you observed on the television yesterday, when we were at the Cabinet, we will start during this week because the majority of the people that have been screened are going to be given cash for food. We are going to give each individual who is entitled to benefit. We will give children, young men, old men, old women, grandfathers and grandmothers who live in those families. We will give them to the price of mealie-meal that we give in the rural areas and the exercise is going to start this week. We will transfer the money through the NetOne OneMoney Wallet – [AN HON. MEMBER:  Inaudible interjection.] –

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER (HON. MAWUNGANIDZE):  Hon. Member, I have heard what you want to say. You would want to say the Minister had forgotten about OneMoney – [HON. MEMBERS:  Inaudible interjections.] – Order Hon. Member! May you take your seat?  Hon. Minister, you may proceed.

HON. MADZIVANYIKA:  On a point of order Madam Speaker.

         THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER (HON. MAUNGANIDZE): Hon. Member may you take your seat? – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections] -

         *HON. JULY MOYO:  In urban centres, we are giving each child, each father, elderly person in that house, but the names should be registered.  What people asked was, there will be a father, mother and the children or the elderly, the money that will be given to each individual, how are you going to go about it?  They have their names taken down, they indicate the name of the person who would have received that money on their behalf. We cannot give them individually.  The majority would want us to give the money to women and we normally give the money to women or mothers because they are the ones who would want to buy the needs for the family.

In communal lands, the last three months, we issued food staff for May, June and July, 2024.  You were asking which people do we give, we give the village heads and the other village heads came and approached us saying we had left out some other people because they had not clearly understood the instruction on the criteria used to select the beneficiaries.  With effect from August, September and October, 2024, we are going to give 6.2 million people.   There has been an addition in the numbers because others had been left out, 6.2 million people out of 9 million people that are in the rural areas, and 1.7 million in urban centres are the ones that are benefitting.  They will have been chosen by their communities in open space and questions are interrogated on why others have been left out and they will say this one has been left out because the mother has a child who is a Minister.   It is such issues that there will be contestation but eventually, we will have a community-based selection which serves us well and it is done when the community is a gathering, hence they select the right beneficiaries. The same process is carried out in rural areas.  I thank you Madam Speaker. 

         HON. NYATHI:  My supplementary question is, what is Government policy towards assisting schools, particularly in urban areas but also including those in rural areas because at the moment, schools in rural areas are not receiving any food to cater for the learners?

         HON. JULY MOYO:  I want to thank the follow up question regarding food distribution to all our primary schools in Zimbabwe.  We took advantage of counselling that was happening in Matabeleland North led by the First Lady.  Madam Speaker, because we knew that schools were assembled, all of them from Matabeleland North in Binga, we took enough food for those coming to Matabeleland North so that they could start way before schools closed for them to be ready for the opening of schools.  A decision has been made that we should give mealie meal instead of giving grain. This mealie meal can be from maize or it could be from wheat or from traditional grains and that is being done through millers. The millers are very busy right now.

We want to give 27 000 metric tonnes of mealie meal to primary schools this term and to date we have covered, as of today, 10 000 tonnes of mealie meal which we are distributing. The distributing modality is that from here in Harare where there is plenty, there is more milling and in some provinces like Marondera where there is some milling, we will take that mealie meal to all the 88 deports of GMB. We will go and station the mealie meal in 88 depots.  A lot of deports are in urban areas, because of distribution in urban areas, they will get their mealie meal from depots here in Harare so they should be the first ones to get it.  When the Marondera ones found out there was mealie meal, the schools organised, already in Marondera the teachers have taken their mealie meal.

Madam Speaker, working with the Ministry of Education, we will not know that we are going to distribute to so many schools but each school has a number because we know the number of children in each school and we equate what we are supposed to give per child.  So, the school tonnage that goes to school A is different from school B, depending on the enrolment.  All those figures we have and all the headmasters, when they go and get their mealie meal, they already know how much they ought to get because either their District Supervisors have already told them or at all the depots of GMB, they have the list of every school in their own area, which they serve and know what tonnage each school has to get.  All that has been done, obviously, when you are moving such a massive tonnage in the shortest period because we want those children to start having that food now.  You will have hitches here and there but I can assure this august House and everyone in this country that the President has said children must have this food.  To add to that, the Ministry of Education has also been allocated some money which they have already distributed to schools so that you can look for palsies for children to have relish. What Government is encouraging is that where there are many boreholes and if you are in town and you have enough ground, we expect the growing of vegetables and other palsies at the school.  This is the Education 5.0 that this country has adopted and we hope that we can demonstrate it during this El Nino induced drought as we try to make sure that our children are not suffering from the effects of this drought.   At the same time obviously, our ZIMLAC shows us the areas of malnutrition, the areas of stunting and this is what we want to avoid and that is why we have this massive school feeding programme.  The Ministry of Finance obviously has put some money mostly for logistics and not for food because the food already belongs to the State.  It belongs to the President because the strategic grain reserve ndiro dura renyika and the food that is stored there is already bought.  What will be remaining is the logistics of getting it to the beneficiaries.  So, I want to assure you Madam Speaker and all the Hon. Members that we will do everything that we can in order to make sure that food gets to the children.

*HON. GUYO: Thank you Madam Speaker, my supplementary question to the Minister is that if the Government has seen it fit that there is a drought especially in the rural areas, is it not possible that they should give everyone food because selection is based on the people that frequent their homestead and others who simply go to the homestead and will not leave any food substance.  They go there drunk and the people remain hungry.  I thank you.

*HON. J. MOYO: Madam Speaker, I am disturbed by the question.  Communities in the rural areas are also business people.  We can, at this time, give them but even if we had all the money in the world, we cannot give everyone because they are in the rural areas.  We know that there are others that are able to fend for themselves and that is why we carry out a selection policy.  We should understand that money is not abundant.  Some have means because they have got those means in the rural areas.  Some have means because they have transfers from their own who are looking after them very well and the community knows this situation and therefore that is why we are asking the community to please select.  If, however, there is somebody who is failing to get because they have a child who does not look after their own mothers and fathers, the community will know kuti kune mwana benzi so let us help this woman.  They will know that but we cannot say that everybody should get these resources because we do not have enough for everyone.  I thank you.

*HON KARENYI:  Thank you Madam Speaker, I would like to thank the Minister for his response but I would also want to make an addition to the response that everyone should be given food handouts.  Yes, Government cannot give those who can afford but what measures has Government put in place to ensure that during this selection process because if people are left to do it themselves, favouritism may take place and other people will be left behind. What checks and balances have you put in place to ensure there is proper monitoring of the selection process by the community?  Are you going to be having officers from your Ministry to oversee the selection process?  Some may be landlords but they are still unable to look after themselves.  Are there any checks and balances to ensure that others are not left behind? 

*HON. J. MOYO:  Madam Speaker, that is a very good question.  I had said the problem that we have in allowing people to select themselves is that some are strong at expressing their views and so on.  So, these are the things that we look at and for us to assist the village heads, we looked for graduates that we have sent out to carry out the selection process and see how it is being done.  The community also has those that oversee the transparency of the selection process.  In February and March, we went with World Food Programme who were giving out to a few people.  We asked WFP how the selection was carried out and we asked if anyone had been left behind.  I remember going to a certain place and the village head who was responsible for selecting eight people only.  I asked him how he got that number as he worked with officials from WFP.  He said they sat down as a community and chose eight poorest people.  There was a problem in coming up with the selection but when we got the eight, we then said if there are any poorer than the eight seated, then those eight would not qualify.  Everyone agreed that those eight were worse off than the rest of the people who were also seeking to be considered.  Problems do arise but the community should sit down and do a transparent process where they come up with a list of the poorest eight because the degrees of poverty does vary and we cannot eradicate their poverty. 

We had tasked the Public Service Commission through its inspectors to find out if officials are doing a good job because there is corruption that tends to creep in.  So, those that we also sent as inspectors were being accused of corrupt tendencies.  The first that we arrested we got the names from the Members of Parliament who divulged the information in this House.  They were arrested and some are in jail. We arrested those in Mashonaland East and Masvingo.  Yesterday we arrested those in Bindura.  We send inspectors to eliminate corruption.  So, if the selection process is corruptly done, please inform us so that we get to interrogate issues on the ground.  In Chipinge, I was told by the Hon. Member of Parliament that people come at 2 o’clock p.m. and want to start distributing the food stuff at 4 o’clock p.m.  We have banned this food distribution beyond 4p.m. because that is when corruption creeps in. When we do these exercises as Hon. Members, we should also ensure that our people are doing it properly so that they emerge from this drought with their dignity and say that Government assisted them through their Members of Parliament and councillors. This is what we call the whole of society and Government approach in doing things.

Questions Without Notice were interrupted by THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER in terms of standing order No. 68.

ORAL ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS WITH NOTICE

PREVENTION OF HUMAN-WILDLIFE CONFLICTS IN DANDE AND MASHONALAND CENTRAL PROVINCE

3. HON. MARIKANO asked the Minister of Environment, Climate Change and Wildlife to apprise the House on Government’s plans to prevent human-wildlife conflicts in the Dande and surrounding areas of Mashonaland Central Province.

         THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, CLIMATE CHANGE AND WILDLIFE (HON. S. NYONI): Allow me to thank the Hon. Member for the question. A number of strategies are being implemented to prevent human wildlife conflict in the Dande and surrounding areas of Mashonaland Central Province and these include the following:

1. Community engagement and education, massive awareness campaigns with other State agencies and conservation partners to educate local communities about wildlife behaviour, conflict avoidance, promote the adaption and alternative farming practices such as the use of deterrents or planting of specific crops that are less attractive to wildlife and the importance of conservation are ongoing.
2. Construction of strong livestock enclosure. Communities are being taught and encouraged to construct strong livestock enclosures for the safety of their livestock from predators.
3. Borehole drilling. To date, a total of six solar powered boreholes have been commissioned through the support of Utariri and Farm Community Trust to reduce fetching of water from the rivers which expose people to crocodile and hippopotamus attacks.
4. Community projects such as vegetable gardens, apiculture, biogas digesters, orchard, weir dams, soap making projects, baking and savings and fish ponds have been rolled out to the communities to improve their livelihoods so that they do not go into the parks.
5. Wildlife management and monitoring efforts are ongoing through the establishment of community-based monitoring systems, early warning mechanisms and deployment of trained Zim Parks rangers and Rural District Councils scouts to respond swiftly to human wildlife conflict incidences.
6. Construction of physical barriers and deterrents creating buffer zones and implementing warning methods to help protect crops and livestock from wildlife invasion.
7. Establishment of ranger posts closer to the affected communities for prompt reaction to human wildlife encounters.
8. Ring fencing of fishing areas. Establish security fencing around identified hotspots areas along infested water bodies and introduction of controlled arsenal fishing and prevent crocodile and hippopotamus attacks.
9. Use of chilli drug bricks to repel elephants and other problem animals is being encouraged.

PRESERVATION OF ENVIRONMENT AND WILDLIFE IN LUPANE AND OTHER RURAL DISTRICTS

4. HON. M. NKOMO asked the Minister of Environment, Climate and Wildlife to inform the House what the Government is doing to preserve the Environment and Wildlife as the future generations’ heritage in Lupane and other parts of the rural districts.

THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, CLIMATE CHANGE AND WILDLIFE (HON. S. NYONI): Firstly, I would like to pinpoint that this question is going to be addressed in two forms, that is, institutional arrangements and through the legal framework.

On legal framework, the current efforts to review the Parks and Wildlife Act is aimed at making sure that there is further decentralisation of ownership, benefits and responsibility to the communities on wildlife and environment. The proposed Bill talks of the delegated authority from appropriate authority which should be a welcome development by the local communities.

Lupane is one of the districts with the appropriate authority where they can utilise wildlife within their area and derive benefits through activities such as hunting and photographic activities.

On the institutional arrangements, in Lupane, there are various institutions where wildlife and the environment are key as far as employment creation is concerned. A bigger portion of Lupane is covered by Forestry Commission where communities benefit from employment for various activities such as hunting, harvesting of furniture timber, education, A1 and A2 farms.  Lupane is one of the districts where communities benefited from the allocation of wildlife farms and most of them are currently into business of hunting, and thus earning revenue for themselves and their families.

I would also want to emphasise that the Ministry through the Departments of EMA, Forestry and Parks will continue working with the RDC of Lupane CAMPFIRE and traditional leaders to educate communities and conduct awareness and outreach programmes on the benefits and preservation of their environment, forest and wildlife and also providing support  through projects such as drilling of boreholes, provision of nutritional gardens, construction of school blocks and in some areas clinics.

         It is critical to note that Lupane RDC also known as Kusile, has been awarded with CAMPFIRE appropriate authority status. CAMPFIRE district play a crucial role in wildlife management with focus on sustainable use of conservation and natural resources including wildlife for the benefit of local communities and future generations.

         There are certain roles that CAMPFIRE is expected to play and these include sustainable wildlife utilisation, human wildlife conflict mitigation, capacity building and training and we hope that all these are being practiced. By fulfilling these roles, Lupane RDC can ensure that long term conservation of wildlife resources support sustainable livelihood and promote inter-generational equity which benefits future and present generations. I thank you.

POLICY REGARDS TO HUMAN AND WILDLIFE CONFLICTS IN LUPANE

5. HON. M. NKOMO asked the Minister of Environment Climate and Wildlife what the Government policy is regarding human and wildlife conflicts in Lupane.

         THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, CLIMATE AND WILDLIFE (HON. S. NYONI): Madam Speaker Ma’am, allow me to thank Hon. Nkomo for the question. Firstly, I would like to stress that Government policy on human and wildlife conflict in Lupane is that the Lupane/Kusile RDC has been given appropriate authority over the wildlife that exists in their area to benefit and as well to be the first port of call to respond to any calls to attend to HWC issues because of their proximity to the communities. Trophies such as hides derived from animals killed as a result of being a problem or a threat to human life are sold and administered through CAMPFIRE for community projects such as drilling of boreholes, clinics, schools, etc.

However, Lupane RDC also works closely with Zimbabwe Parks for quick reaction on how HWC reports and animals that are considered a problem in the community are usually eliminated.

         HON. NKOMO: My supplementary question is what measures are being taken by the Ministry to protect the communities from the wildlife?

         HON. S. NYONI: Thank you Hon. Nkomo. As I have said, we are running educational programmes. This is a process that the Ministry cannot do alone. We also need RDC, we need the community to be aware and human wildlife conflict is a very complicated issue that needs  the community, the authorities that are on the ground, our  rangers as well as the Ministry is represented by our  rangers and whoever is on the ground to work together so that this can be avoided. Also, fencing does help. The cooperation between Zimbabwe Parks and RDC needs to continue in order to find a lasting solution. I thank you.

         HON. MAMOMBE: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am. Allow me to thank the Hon. Member for asking a very pertinent question on human wildlife conflict and also the response from the Hon. Minister. I think the question is how does the community benefit from the resources after they kill the elephants from their hunting quotas. In these communities like Lupane for example, in the question that the Hon. Member asked, Lupane as a district are given a quotas of their elephants. They kill those quotas and they are shared amongst the communities through the CAMPFIRE, but what is happening in these communities is that sometimes women for example, will not be represented in these CAMPFIRE executives or in the RDCs.

         When they share the quotas from the elephants, you find that the women who are the victims of human wildlife conflict are the ones who do not even benefit from the quotas that the Hon. Minister is presenting. It is a plea to say the Ministry must make sure that in the executive of the CAMPFIRE, women must be represented because they are the ones who are facing human wildlife conflict. When it comes to benefits, the quotas from the elephants, women are nowhere to be seen. Thank you.

         HON. S. NYONI: Thank you Madam Speaker. I want to thank the Hon. Member. It is very pertinent that women benefit whatever  comes from their local resources. They need to equally benefit because they are equal members of the community. This is a responsibility of all of us. As a Ministry, we have a policy of gender equality and implementation of that, we need even the local Member of Parliament. They need to take interest when these elections at RDC take place to make sure that is implemented.

         As a Ministry, we have a policy and we would like gender equality realised, but sometimes when these elections take place, the Ministry will not be there. I would like to plead with the local Members of Parliament and the RDC members to make sure that this policy of gender equality is represented.

         *HON. NYABANI: I wanted to say well-done Hon. Minister because all over the country, there are such problems. Where there are members of the Department of Parks and Wildlife, they travel long  distances to attend to these animals that are having this conflict with the people. If you call them, they tell you that they have no vehicles to travel in time and meanwhile crops are being destroyed. Do you have any methods to ensure that these people benefit because the money is given to the community and not to the individual people who have suffered? Ideally, we would want a situation where they are individually compensated. They are no longer able to send their children to school because their crops have been destroyed. What measures are you putting in place to ensure that we have rangers in the vicinity of the conflicts. The rangers could be Bindura and the conflict will be in Bulawayo. Thank you.

         HON. S. NYONI: So, if there is an area that has got rangers that live in town or live in remote areas instead of living around the parks close to the people, they must let us know, that should be corrected. The Ministry`s policy is that rangers must work to make sure that their duty is to make sure that if there is an incident between humans and wildlife they act very quickly.   If that is the case please let us know. We want that corrected. It is also equally our concern. I thank you.

         *HON. NYABANI: What about the question of compensation to the individuals whose properties would have been destroyed?  What does Government have in place?  

         THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER (HON. MAUNGANIDZE) : Hon. Nyabani, I did not recognise you, you do not just speak.

         HON. NYABANI: My apologies.

COMPENSATION OF VILLAGERS WHO ARE VICTIMS OF HUMAN AND WILDLIFE CONFLICTS

6. HON. M. NKOMO asked the Hon. Minister of Environment and Climate Wildlife the play that the Ministry has put in place to compensate villagers who are victims of human and wildlife conflicts.

THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT AND CLIMATE WILDLIFE (HON. S. NYONI):  Mr. Speaker, allow me to thank Hon. M. Nkomo for the question. Firstly, I would like to stress that Zimbabwe as a country we do not have any policy in place on compensation although CAMPFIRE District are using local arrangements through CAMPFIRE funds to assist victims on funeral and medical bills and in some district going as far as paying fees to the children of victims in local government schools. Through the Cabinet resolution of November 2022 and re-affirming the SONA of August 2023 by His Excellence, The President of the Republic of Zimbabwe Dr. E.D Mnangagwa to establish the Human Wildlife Conflict Relief Fund (HWCRF), The Parks and Wildlife Bill which is undergoing public consultations. It is important to note that once the Bill is signed into Act, victims will start to receive relief funds and the fund only focus on death, injury, maiming and hospitalisation.

The Ministry has advocated for the HWC relief fund which has since been approved by the cabinet and efforts are underway to put structures on how to get the funds and how it will be managed. Secondly, in relation to the Compensation, I would like to categorically say that it is difficult to compensation HWC Cases. Wherever it was done, compensation for Human – Wildlife Conflict (HWC) cases proved to be difficult for several reasons.

1. Proof of damage: establishing proof of damage or loss caused by wildlife or loss caused by wildlife can be challenged, especially in rural areas with limited access to documentation or evidence.
2. Valuation of losses: Accurately valuing losses, such as crop damage or livestock funding constraints or limited resources to provide adequate compensation.
3. Funding and resources: Government or conservation organisations may face funding constraints or limited resources to provide adequate compensation
4. Bureaucratic process: Compensation claims often involve lengthy bureaucratic process, delaying payment and causing frustration among affected communities.
5. Limited coverage: Compensation schemes might not cover all types of HWC, such as damage to property or human injury.
6. Inequitable distribution: Compensation may be not distributed fairly, with some communities or individuals receiving more than others.
7. Perceived unfairness: Communities may feel that compensation is inadequate or unfair, leading to resentment and decreased cooperation in conservation efforts.
8. Lack of trust: Trust issues between communities, government and conservation organisation can hinder effective compensation mechanisms.
9. Cultural and social factors: Cultural and social factors, such as traditional practices or social norms, can influence perceptions of compensation and HWC.
10. Policy and legislative framework: Weak or inadequate policies and legislation can hinder effective compensation mechanisms.
11. Un applicability of the compensation policy: it is not possible to compensate loss of life in cases where human life is lost.

Therefore, Lupane as a CAMPFIRE district have their local arrangement like any other CAMPFIRE districts in Zimbabwe to assist their community members in relation to HWC cases depending on the availability of funds. It is also important to note that the relief paid by a particular CAMPFIRE to victims’ areas have less because they have less wildlife products to sell and raise revenue compared to other mainly because of how close are they located from a protected area.

         *HON. PRISCILLA MOYO: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  I would like to thank the Minister for the response.  This is a matter that is disheartening, the conflict between animals and humans.  I heard you saying that there is no Government policy as to how compensation should be paid.  What about those who have conservatives that are near communal lands.  The animals may escape from the confined area, the fence, what does the Government policy say as regards conservancy owners who allow their animals to leave the confined areas and spread diseases to the people and cattle?  I thank you.

         HON. S. NYONI: I would like to thank Hon. Moyo for the question.  Indeed, it is also a concern for the Ministry that in some conservancies and even in parks, efforts are made to erect the fences but then people do destroy some of the fences that are erected.  I think we need a conversation between the local traditional leadership and the people to make sure that when fences are erected, they are also protected.  It is very important also for our people to feel a part of our conservancies so that they protect both the animals as well as the amenities that will be provided, including the fences.  Indeed, this is a very serious concern.  Human-wildlife conflict can be very dangerous and can result in the loss of life.  So, let us work together, local leadership, the Ministry and the community to make sure that it is prevented and managed.  I thank you.

         HON. JAMES: Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  I would like to thank the Hon. Minister for your contribution today.  A lot has been mentioned about CAMPFIRE.  My understanding is that where CAMPFIRE projects files in some areas is that the benefits accrued are not getting down to the local communities.  They trickle down through various authorities that take it before it is really due.  Is the Ministry aware of this and is there some sort of policy to make sure that the CAMPFIRE benefits do get to the very bottom of the community members?  Thank you.

THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, CLIMATE AND WILDLIFE (HON. S. NYONI): Thank you Madam Speaker. I think, if there are any specific problems that are specific to CAMPFIRES and areas, please let us know. It will not take us long to come there and sit down with the relevant authorities, the CAMPFIRE leadership and also the community to make sure that things are done properly and that the benefit goes to where it should go.  Please, let us know. We will be there to try and help if this is within our powers to bring all the parties together and to ensure that things are done properly and the benefit goes where it should go. I thank you Madam Speaker.

         ⁺HON. MAHLANGU: Thank you for the question that was asked by the Hon. Member. What sentence or penalty is levied on offenders who vandalise the fence the Government would have enacted so that animals cannot encroach into areas where people are?

         +HON. S. NYONI: Thank you Madam Speaker and the Hon. Member for the question. On the sentence which is there, as of now, we are requesting the police officers to apprehend those who would have cut the fence which is protecting people from wild animals. Once that fence is enacted, anyone who vandalises that should be arrested by police and sentenced according to the laws of the country. I thank you.

ESTABLISHMENT OF PERIMETER FENCES AROUND NATIONAL PARKS

7. HON. BONDA asked the Minister of Environment, Climate and Wildlife to inform the House on any Government plans to establish perimeter fences around national parks to mitigate human-wildlife conflict, particularly in communities such as Mabale, Jwabhe, and Magoli villages where lions are reportedly preying people’s livestock.

THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, CLIMATE AND WILDLIFE (HON. S. NYONI):  Thank you Madam Speaker. In response to Hon. Bonda’s question, Hwange has a veterinary fence which was vandalised by the people.  This also applies to other areas, such as Chirisa, which had the veterinary fence and has all been completely vandalised.

Madam Speaker Ma’am, it is important to note that it is expensive to secure fences that can stop animals such as elephants, since the elephants can also come and destroy the same fence meant to stop the lions. Whilst lions are considered a problem also to livestock, elephants are also a problem in destruction of crops and cause injuries or death when attacking human beings.

Hence, efforts to erect fences should cover all the problem species and preferably electrified with powerful voltage to stop the elephants. This may not be practically possible considering the extent of the area to be fenced. Certain species such as leopards would require very high and electrified fences. It is important that decisions around fences should not focus on lions alone but all other problem animals such as wild dogs, hyenas, jackals, leopards and elephants so that the solution is holistic.

Strong awareness campaigns and buy-in from the communities is needed so that fences are not destroyed soon after they have been erected, such as was the case with the fences along the major roads. A well-coordinated land use plan that avoids developments within wildlife corridors is a better solution in addressing issues of human and wildlife conflict in this area and in any other, as we have alluded to before. I thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.

HON. BONDA:  Thank you Madam Speaker. We have had incidences where two community members are imprisoned for protecting livestock and their families, which is a right to every man to protect his family, by eliminating the lions that at one time killed a child in the same village of Mambanje area. Is defending the family and the livestock from these animals an offence by eliminating them using any defensive methods that might be traditional as rangers, at times, do not arrive on time and are overwhelmed? Thank you.

HON. S. NYONI:  Thank you Madam Speaker. I think that is sad and condolences. I think then that is in the hands of the law but I think it is very sad that someone who was defending his/her family then killed a lion, which maybe should have killed a child, then that person gets arrested. These are the issues that maybe, when we look at our ZimParks and Wildlife Bill, we need to look into and see what we incorporate in order to avoid or to take care of issues like these. I thank you Madam Speaker.

HON. DR. KHUPE:  Thank you Madam Speaker. My question to the Minister is, are animals more important than people?  As we speak right now, someone is in prison and this is an urgent matter. If we wait for the Bill, the Bill might take ages. I think it is important that as a Ministry, you act as fast as you can to make sure that you engage the police so that these people are released from prison. Honestly, they cannot be in prison for defending their children. Unless, if you are saying, animals are more important than people but for me, animals will never be more important than people. Can you please do something to make sure that they are released. I thank you.

HON. S. NYONI:  Thank you Hon. Khupe. Honestly, there is no sane human being who can say animals are more important than people. The Ministry cannot say that and I cannot say that. People are more important than animals but this is a case that happened outside the Ministry and it is the first time I am hearing about it. Indeed, something needs to be done. As you all know, you are lawmakers, if the court makes a decision, that does not mean we cannot appeal or repeal. I think it is not being fair to say, animals are more important than people. People are more important than animals. In a case like this, something needs to be done and the Ministry has taken note of the concerns of this House. I thank you.

          HON. MADZIVANYIKA: Thank you Madam Speaker. I think this is a very sensitive issue and I would like to applaud the Minister for the good response. However, is it not possible Minister to have an urgent Statutory Instrument that deals with this situation?  Yes, we must also protect our wild animals if it is proved beyond doubt that it is the human element that provoked animals, under the circumstances, then it is a different matter. Can we have a Statutory Instrument Hon. Minister to this effect so that we protect innocent people who will be trying to defend themselves? I thank you.

         HON. S. NYONI: Point taken Hon. Member.

PROMOTION OF CORPORATE SOCIAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR MINING COMPANIES

18. HON. GUMEDE asked the Minister of Mines and Mining Development to inform the House what is the Ministry’s policy on promotion of corporate social responsibility for mining companies operating in close proximity to residential particularly for those conducting operations in the vicinity of residential areas as is the case with Old Nic Mine, McDonald Bricks and Quarry in Bulawayo North.

         THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF MINES AND MINING DEVELOPMENT (HON. KAMBAMURA): Thank you very much Madam Speaker Ma’am. I would like to thank Hon. Gumede for the question. Hon. Speaker Ma’am, mining companies’ operations are guided by the Mines and Minerals Act, which among other things stipulates the distances allowed to conduct mining operations away from residential or built up areas.

         Currently, Corporate Social Responsibility (CSR) is not legislated for, however, companies are encouraged to conduct CSR in their areas of operation so that they are good corporate citizens. Further, the CSR projects should be in line with the needs of the communities and relevant stakeholders for the CSR projects to be effective, useful and mutually beneficial to all concerned.

         In terms of responsible corporate citizens under governance pillar, mining companies disclose their CSR projects. Mining companies are also always encouraged to work with the Government, through Ministry of Mines and Mining Development as well as the Minister of State for Provincial Affairs and Devolution in respective provinces and to consult the community through traditional leaders whenever they carry out corporate social responsibility projects.

         With regards to specific mines, that is, Old Nic Mine and McDonald Bricks and Quarry in Bulawayo, the companies do have some programs targeting communities in the education and other social areas. Hualin Quarry, in particular has paid school fees for a number of pupils in the surrounding schools as well as examination fees for less privileged students at high schools. The company has also since 2022 been annually providing food hampers to the elderly, to people with disabilities, and orphans in Ward 17 and at Zimkids Day Care Orphanage Centre on a monthly beneficiary. The company has also been donating quarry to public institutions such as Pumula High School. Old Nic Mine purchased theatre equipment for United Bulawayo Hospital and intends to do hospital renovations in the near future.

         McDonalds Bricks is a sponsor of the Prize-Giving Day ceremony at Mtshabezi High School especially for the building studies department. This initiative helps strengthen the capacity of communities through young educated students in quality primary educational institutions. As stated above, corporate social responsibility is currently not legislated and it is done on a voluntary basis, making it difficult for the Ministry to follow up on Mining Companies CSR projects. The Ministry has however taken note of the legal gap and in the current draft of the Mines and Minerals Bill; we intend to make corporate social responsibility compulsory for all miners.                                                                                    ⁺HON. GUMEDE:  Thank you Madam Speaker for the response from the Minister.  Firstly, I agree with his point that we should have a legal framework that will look into the issue of companies that are doing mining and other activities in our areas as they are doing corporate social responsibility.  The Minister did not mention about the Minister of Mines and Mining Development to inform the House what the Ministry’s policy on promotion of corporate social responsibility for mining companies is on operating in close proximity to residential areas? This is in particular to those conducting operations near residential areas as is the case with Old Nic Mine, McDonald Bricks and Quarry in Bulawayo North on what he has done but he spoke about other companies on what they are doing. 

McDonalds has many customers, every day they pass using the Killarney Road but we do not have anything that we are seeing except that they are destroying our roads and getting into the residential areas using the roads, which are not supposed to be used by trucks.  It is our plea that the Minister should emphasise that as they are work in our areas, they should carry out social responsibility from whatever they are getting from their customers.  They should also repair the roads that they are using on daily basis.  If you go there, you will find that these roads are impassable. We are really in danger from using those roads but we have big companies like McDonalds sponsoring us with bricks or cement so that we can build a clinic or something else.  Thank you Madam Speaker.

         HON. KAMBAMURA: Thank you Hon. Speaker and I want to thank the Hon. Member for the follow up questions. If the Hon. Member listened, I said that McDonalds Bricks is an annual sponsor for the Prize Giving Day at Mtshabezi High School specifically in the building studies department.  However, I have taken note to what she has highlighted that the community is looking forward to the company to do more, especially in the area of road rehabilitation and construction which she alleges the road was damaged by that company. The issue of which road they should be using, that one is legislated by the local authority in which the company is  operating.  However, as a Ministry, I am going to take that up so that we talk to the company, so that they can assist the community.   I am not quite sure if the Hon. Member had attempted to engage the company on the issues that she has raised.  If she has done so, what was their response because it is not mainly that companies operating are making profits, some will be making losses.  So, we need to sit down with them and give them our projects.  We discuss with them and agree on which projects they are able to do for the community.  I agree with the Hon. Member that communities are supposed to benefit from the resources around them.  I thank you.

*HON. NYABANI:  Thank you Madam Speaker. Corporate social responsibility maybe in the form of books and other immaterial things.  These are finite resources and once they have been exhausted what are these investors going to leave for the people of Zimbabwe? How are our people going to live?   They should leave an investment whether they are in the form of plantation or in the form of dams, so that people can make a livelihood out of it.  Also, cooking oil and lotion are immaterial for corporate social responsibility.  Let us have investment.  I thank you.

HON.  KAMBAMURA:   Hon. Speaker Ma’am, I did not get the last part of the question.  What exactly did he ask?  May you kindly assist me.

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER (HON. MAUNGANIDZE): Hon. Nyabani, may you please come again.  Can you elaborate?

*HON. NYABANI: I have said that corporate social responsibility, one simply has to feed the children whether you are there or not.  If they are not there, the children will starve. If you create a greenhouse, there will be ten bags in the green house.  If you have sent them to school, that will be an investment.  All these resources are finite.  After they are exhausted, what will you benefit from when corporate social responsibility is no longer there.  We would want them to come in with corporate social investment in the form of wealth and not a corporate social responsibility.  As a Ministry or Government, what policy are you going to come up with so that you move away from corporate social responsibility and move to corporate social investment. 

*HON.  KAMBAMURA: Thank you Madam Speaker.  I would want to thank Hon. Nyabani for the question in the form of a supplementary question.  As Government, we are going to put in the Mines and Minerals Act, sections that make it mandatory for companies to inform the Ministry about what the corporate responsibility will be and how they are going to work with communities and also ask them about the environmental impact assessment in the areas.  As a Ministry, we observed that there was a lacuna which needs to be sorted out and that is why we are bridging the gap in the form of Mines and Minerals Act. We are aware of that problem.  I thank you.

CONFLICTS BETWEEN SMALL SCALE AND LARGE-SCALE MINERS

19. HON. MPASI asked the Minister of Mines and Mining Development to inform the House on the reported conflicts between many small scale miners, with large scale mining operators which are caused by the overlapping of unclear demarcated mining claims and to further apprise the House on the reforms that are being considered, in order to clarify mining rights and establish more efficient dispute resolution mechanisms.

          THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF MINES AND MINING DEVELOPMENT (HON. KAMBAMURA):  Madam Speaker Ma’am, thank you.  The overlapping of unclear demarcated mining claims has indeed been a source of tension and disputes within the mining sector.  These conflicts can result in operational disruptions, legal battles and even violence, which are detrimental to the mining industry and the broader economy.

             The primary issue arises from the overlapping of mining claims, which is often a result of historical inadequacies in claim demarcation, insufficient records, and outdated mapping technologies.

Small scale miners, who often operate informally, may encroach on areas allocated to large scale operators, leading to disputes.  Conversely, large scale operators may also lay claim to areas traditionally mined by artisanal miners.

REFORMS THAT ARE BEING CONSIDERED

1. Use of GPS.

         The mines and Minerals Bill provides for the application of information technology in the establishment and exercise of mining rights through the use of Global Positioning System.  The Ministry is in the process of acquiring Differential GPS equipment with an error margin of +-1 cm.  This will resolve the problem of overlapping since verification will be done using advanced technology prior to one being issued with a mining title.

1. Computerised Mining Cadastre System

       The Mines and Minerals Bill provides for the establishment of the office of the Mining Cadastre Registrar, who will be responsible for registering all mining titles in the Mining Cadastre Registry.  This computerised system will solve the current problem that is being faced whereby maps can get lost, torn or tempered with.  With the computerised system it will be clear whether the land being applied for is open for pegging and prospecting.  If the land is already occupied by a current mining title the system will automatically reject registration of a new title, unlike in the current manual system where several titles may be erroneously registered on the same location, thereby creating disputes.

         iii. Clearly laid out procedures for resolving disputes

         The Mines and Minerals Bill provides for the detailed dispute resolution procedure.  This includes the specifications on who presides over the dispute, the time lines within which complaints must be lodged, and the period within which a determination must be made.  Under the current system there are no time lines within which a determination must be made, and as a result some disputes may go on for years without a determination having been made.  The Bill further provides for the procedure of appeal if one is not happy with the determination of the Provincial Mining Director/ Permanent Secretary/Minister.  I thank you.

WRITTEN SUBMISSION TO QUESTION WITH NOTICE

PAYMENT OF PENSIONS TO MINE EMPLOYEES IN USD CURRENCY

20. HON. MUROMBEDZI: asked the Minister of Mines and Mining Development

(a) inform the House the Government’s position regarding mine employees who contributed their pensions to the Mining Industry Pension Fund in USD currency, but are now having their payouts in the local currency;

(b) explain the measures that have been put in place to ensure those who made their pension contributions get their pensions in the currency and value they contributed.

  INTRODUCTION

The Ministry acknowledges the need to protect the financial interests and well- being of pensioners in the mining sector.  Our position on this matter is based on principles of fairness, equity and sustainability.  Government is committed to ensuring that pension payouts reflect the true value of the contributions made in USD.

Realising that this did not fall within the Ministry of Mines and Mining Development’s purview, the Ministry requested the Insurance and Pensions Commission (IPEC) to provide responses in its capacity as the regulator for the Mining Industry Pension Fund.  The information obtained from IPEC has been used to craft a response as follows:

Background about the Mining Industry Pension Fund:

1. The number pf participating employers, i.e, mining companies contributing to MIPF as at 30 June 2024 were 146. Total membership of the pension fund as at 30 June 2024 stood at 94,084.

USD Contribution to MIPF during the Multi- Currency Era (2009 to 2019)

2. Following the introduction of the multi – currency regime in March 2009, the fund started receiving contributions in the United States Dollar, which was the functional currency until 2019. Therefore, the fund’s pension contributions investment returns and benefits were paid in foreign currency during this period.

2019 Currency Reforms:

3. The currency reform implemented in 2019 had the effect of re- dominating all foreign currency assets and liabilities into ZWL as the new mono currency. Drawing lessons from the 2009 currency reform, IPEC issued a Guidance Paper on the Conversion of Insurance and Pension Liabilities from the USD to the ZWL. The objective of the Guidance Paper was to ensure pension fund members and policyholders equitably benefit from the revaluation gains on assets that supported their liabilities prior to the 2019 currency conversion. .8. Whilst the Guidance Paper assisted in cushioning pensioners from 2019 effects of currency change and subsequent  hyperinflationary environment, monetary assets that converted on a parity exchange rate US$1:1zwl lost value.  These include bonds, money market and cash.  Therefore, MIPF members lost some value of the USD contributions and investment returns made during the period 2009 to 2019.

USD contributions to MIFP (2019 to 2020)

4. During the period 2019 to 2020, the Government adopted ZWL as the mono-currency, hence pension contributions and benefits were paid in ZWL. However, IPEC lobbied for the gazetting of Statutory Instrument 280 of 2020, which provides for the payment of pension contributions in foreign currency, investments to be done in the matching currency and pension benefits being payable in the same currency.  I 280 of 2020 was premised on the fact that there are forex generating employers such as mining houses, NGOs, including UN agencies and export generating companies, which were paying their employees in forex.  Since pension contracts are born out of contracts of employment, it was therefore justifiable to allow contributions in forex.  Following the gazetting of S.I 280 of 2020, some MIFP participating mining houses commenced pension contributions in foreign currency as the salaries were denominated in foreign currency.  As at 30 June 2024, 61 out of the 146 participating employers were remitting USD pension contributions to MIFP whilst 89 in ZiG.  Some mines paid both Zig and USD contributions.

USD Foreign Currency Contribution Arrears:

5. IPEC notes that some mining houses are deducting pension contributions from employee salaries but not remitting the same to MIFP. USD pension contribution arrears as at 30 June 2024 stood at US$10.54 million.  Of this amount, one mine ZCDC is owing 51% of the total debtors book for the Fund and the amount is payable in USD.

  Therefore, beneficiaries from such mines will not be able to access their USD benefits if the situation is sustained into the future despite the legitimate expectation of receiving USD benefits after deduction would have been made in forex.  We, therefore, implore mining houses in pension contribution arrears to make good the arrears to pension funds.  IPEC is engaging the sponsoring employers in line with provision of the new Pension and Provident Funds Act, which provides for garnish powers should the employers not comply with the requirement to remit contributions.

  Mining Housing Paying Contribution in ZiG:

6. Whilst most mines are generally paying their employees in USD, some big mining houses are paying pension contributions in local currency despite deductions having been made in forex. In terms of ZWG contributions, 89 participating employers re remitting in ZWG with the top 5 making the greater share of ZWG contributions.  These include Zimplats, Hwange Colliery, Trojan Nickel, Renco Mine, RioZim and others.

  The mining Industry Pension Fund is currently dealing with a crisis of expectation from members of participating employers who are paying salaries in USD, deducting pension contributions from the payroll in USD, but remitting pension contributions in local currency.  In such situations, the sponsoring employers are unfairly benefitting from the forex deductions, particularly the premium between the official and the alternative exchange rate.  To this end, MIFP will be incapacitated to pay USD pension benefits to such employees, yet they expect USD benefits.

  USD Investment Income from Forex Generating Assets:

7. MIFP has over the years been investing in foreign currency generating assets such as real estate, listed equity, money market and private equity. Such assets have been generating forex income, which IPEC is insisting should benefit members of the fund.  As at 30 June 2024, MIFP’s total assets amounted to ZWG 2,88,474,704.66 and USD 70.9million.  The total forex income for the fund as at 30 June 2024 was USD14.5 million.  The fund also made an offshore investment to the tune of USD1,725,970.69.

  Payment of Benefits in Foreign Currency for All Pensioners:

8. In line with requirements of S.I 280 of 2020 and the forex generating capacity of assets of the fund, MIFP’s pensioners are all receiving USD cushioning allowances effective July 2023. These were paid as a once off in 2023 and quarterly in 2024.  For the year 2023, USD2,38 million was paid out to pensioners and USD3,75 million has been paid for 2024.  This was over and above the monthly local currency pensions.

MEASURES BEING PUT IN PLACE TO RING FENCE USD CONTRIBUTIONS AND INCOME FOR PAYMENT OF BENEFITS TO MEMBERS ARE AS FOLLOWS:

1. I 280 of 2020

  As highlighted above, S.I 280 of 2020 was gazetted to protect members of pension funds whose employers are remitting contributions in forex such that the investments are made in forex generating assets and benefits payable in forex.  In line with provisions of the Statutory Instrument, MIFP has commenced payment of benefits in forex together with local currency denominated benefits.

Forex Denominated Investments Assets:

MIFPis investing in assets that generate forex, which include investment property, offshore investments and money market, among others.  The fund is obliged to report to IPEC every quarter on forex earnings and expenditure, including benefits that would have been paid to pensioners.

Benefit Statements on Forex Contributions and Benefits:

The Fund is also required by IPEC to conduct AGMs and issue benefit statements every year, including sharing with members a summary of the financial performance of the fund.  We believe such measures will help to ensure pension fund members are getting their rightful benefits in the process enhancing accountability and transparency to members.  Drawing lessons from the pre2009 currency reforms and reforms that have taken place post 2019, the new Pension and Provident Funds Act [Chapter 24:32] now have provisions to guide the conversion of a pension fund’s assets and liabilities in response to currency reforms.  Such a provisions is meant to protect pension fund members in the event of a currency change.

Conclusion:

MIFP is paying benefits in foreign currency to its pensioners as informed by the investment income from foreign currency denominated assets and funds contributions from the few funds that are remitting to MIFP in forex.  There are big mining houses that are deducting pension contributions in forex.  There are big mining houses that are deducting pension contributions in forex but remitting ZiG to MIFP, in the process prejudicing their employees and creating an expectation crisis.

Some funds are also incurring contribution arrears in forex, which will impact negatively on the welfare of pensioners if the arrears remain uncleared.  We call upon the respective funds to balance interests of the employer and that of the fund welfare of the fund members.

The Ministry of Mines and Mining Development unfortunately does not directly administer Pension Funds and therefore refers this issue to the appropriate Ministry being the Ministry of Finance.

         Questions With Notice were interrupted by the TEMPORARY SPEAKER, in terms of Standing Order Number 68.

MOTION

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

         HON. KAMBUZUMA: I move that Orders of the Day, Numbers 1 to16 on today’s Order Paper, be stood over until Order of the Day Number 17 has been disposed of.

         HON. NYANDORO: I second.

         Motion put and agreed to.

MOTION

FINANCE BILL: 2024 MID-TERM BUDGET AND ECONOMIC REVIEW

Seventeenth Order read: Adjourned debate on motion that leave be

granted to bring in a Finance Bill.

         Question again proposed.

         HON. F. MOYO: I want to appreciate the presentation by the Hon. Minister. It was really a candid and open presentation of the facts that affect our economy. Our Committee also did a very good job to critique the presentation by the Minister. I will make comments pointed at one sector of the economy which is the mining sector and I am happy the Minister of Mines is here.

We recognise that the Ministry of Mines or rather the mineral sector is pivotal to the growth of our economy today and into the future. The reason is that the Ministry of Mines or the mineral sectors anchors our GDP. It brings in the majority or the bulk of our forex into the country. It also receives the majority or the bigger number of our forex inflows into the country. We also stand a good chance of industrialising the country if the mining sector comes on board and performs to the level that we expect it to perform.

The mining sector also has the opportunity to create more employment because it does create employment through big companies as well as small operators to the extent of those who self-employ. We also expect the mining sector to anchor the industrialisation of the economy and also anchor development of our communities through support to the communities in which they operate. They do this through local employment. They must do this through support to local infrastructure and all these are the responsibilities that the mining sector should carry in order for them to anchor the economic development of the nation.

I looked at the presentation by the Hon. Minister and I genuinely felt that the mineral sector was not given adequate coverage in his presentation. If you look at the potential and pivotal role that the mineral sector plays as I have said above, you would expect that they would be adequate discussion to let this House understand exactly what is happening in the sector that brings in 60% of forex and anchors our infrastructure and all the other benefits that we can get from it. The Hon. Minister presented in his report the price indications of key minerals; gold, lithium, base minerals as well as platinum. I think that is basically all that we heard.

I want to point out that success of the mineral commodity sector does not necessary depend on the price that the minerals can fetch because the producers do not really have much influence over prices. The benefit that we must draw from the mining sector is for us to focus on whether as a country and sector, we are a low, average or high cost producer. When the international market of mineral commodities shrinks, it is in fact the high cost producers who fall out first. So, projecting prices is very good. We can see that next year things will be stable commodity pricewise.

What we do not know from the Hon. Minister’s presentation is what will be the cost structure in that sector. If we are going to have, like now, gold is selling at US$2 200 per ounce. If we produce below a

1 000, it means that our mines are making gross profits of 60%. If they are not gross profits of 60%, it means that their costs are very high. So, why are our costs very high. This is the area that I expect that we should analyse because the fiscus does not seem to be receiving a lot of returns from the sector which means we are in fact a high cost producer. If we are that, then it does not really make much sense to project and indicate in our report only the price of mineral projections without indicating at what cost we are going to support that projected mineral price.

         So, I thought in future, it will be useful for Hon. Minister to indicate all the key minerals to say this is the trend going forward and, in our circumstances, these are the costs that are going to be incurred and then compare those. For instance, we are discussing a lot on lithium. My own personal view is that our lithium, by virtue of how we mine it and transport it to the market, we will not compete with America and Asia. So, that mineral may not bring a lot to the country. We may see the price being up there but the cost of production is going to be very high so the country will not necessarily benefit. Those are my few comments to the Hon. Minister and if he could consider, in future, to put such a report. Thank you.

         HON. S. ZIYAMBI: Let me also add my voice on the 2024 Mid-Term Fiscal Policy by the Minister of Finance and Economic Development, Hon. Prof. Mthuli Ncube. I would like to say that the Minister noted that there was an improvement in revenue collection and the total revenue collection of ZiG$36,5 billion in the first half of 2024 dominated the previous fiscal challenges.

On fiscal discipline, the expenditure performance shows a remarkable 44,2% utilisation of the approved budget. A significant improvement from 82,3% in the previous year. This indicated a commitment to fiscal discipline and prudent management which is commendable given the economic climate. The introduction of the Zimbabwe Gold backed currency ZiG has provided stability allowing for better financial planning and reduced inflation. This stability is vital for sustaining economic growth and fostering investor confidence.

On effective budget utilisation, some ministries have utilised their budget extensively and this presents an opportunity for targeted investment in key areas. For instance, the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructural Development has shown pro-active engagement suggesting potential for increased infrastructural development that could spare economic growth.

         On policy consistency, the decrease in VAT, revenue and the reintroduction of exemptions indicate the need for policy stability.  I would urge the Treasury to conduct a thorough evaluation of these policies to ensure that they align with long term economic growth.  Consistent policies will foster predictable business environment and enhancing investor confident. 

Addressing public debt concerns the increase in public debt. It provides us with a clear mandate to innovate our fiscal strategies.  I recommend the Minister of Finance to present a robust plan to manage and reduce debt levels sustainably focusing on enhancing revenue through improved compliance and broadening the tax base. 

         Support for underperforming ministries - the findings that certain Ministries have exhausted their budgets by mid-year suggest a need for better forecasting and resource allocation.  I propose establishing monitoring frame work to ensure that all ministries can meet their operational needs without over reliance on supplementary budgets. 

Madam Speaker, on market distortions from VAT exemptions - the VAT exemptions on poultry meat and kapenta are beneficial.  They could create market distortions by shifting demand away from other meat products.  I also recommend a comprehensive review of the implications of these exemptions to ensure a balanced approach that supports all sectors of the meat industry without creating unfair disadvantages.

         On enhanced consideration for local currency usage - although the proposal encourages local currency payments, it is essential to expand the acceptance of the ZiG for initial commodities price in USD such as fuel and passports.  This will further solidify the credibility and usability of our local currency.  I also urge the fiscal authorities to explore strategies that enable broader acceptance of the ZiG in their vital areas.

         On monitoring the impact on informal sector compliance - the shift to requiring payment of presumptive taxes in local currency is a positive step. It will be crucial to monitor how this affects compliance rates in the informal sector.  I suggest implementing outreach programmes to educate informal businesses about the benefits of transitioning to local currency transactions.

Implementation of presumptive tax measures - the reduction of presumptive tax is positive and it is vital to ensure that this change is communicated effectively to all stakeholders in the informal sector.

         Additionally, ongoing education and support will be necessary to help these operations navigate the tax system. 

On public awareness on exercise duty on e-cigarette - the implementation of the exercise duty on e-cigarettes should be accompanied by a public awareness campaign to educate consumers on the health risks associated with these products.  This will enhance the effectiveness of the policy in reducing consumption and improving public health outcomes. 

On concerns over transit fuel duty implementation - the intention to curb transit fraud is commendable and the proposed duty and reimbursement mechanism may inadvertently complicate the logistics for genuine transit consignments.  I recommend a thorough review of administrative processes to ensure that the legitimate businesses are not unduly burdened.  Enhanced monitoring measures should be prioritised over punitive duties. 

Challenges with fiscalisation of fuel sales - although fiscalisation aims to optimise revenue, the complexity of linking sales may create challenges.  It is essential to simplify the process to ensure the businesses can easily comply without incurring excess administrative costs.  Clear guidelines support from ZIMRA will be crucial for successful implementation.  Thank you.

HON. G. HLATYWAYO:  Thank you Madam Speaker for giving me the opportunity to add my voice to this very important discussion.  I just have a few points to make on the Finance Bill. 

The first point that I wish to share with the House is on our national debt.  The current debt stock that we have in Zimbabwe at the present moment is unsustainable.  The Annual Public Debt bulleting indicated that the public and public guaranteed debt as of December 2023 represented 96.7 of the GDP.  This exceeds the legislative limit of 70% in terms of the Public Debt Management Act. 

The impact on social services such as health, education and other social services is huge as resources that are meant to benefit citizens directly are diverted to servicing these debts, therefore leaving citizens impoverished.  It is also import to have this debt that we are talking about audited to avoid a situation where the debt is arduous.  I also fully associate with the call by the Budget Committee to have a medium-term debt strategy presented to this House on strategies being adopted to deal with the debt as directed by the Public Debt Management Act.

         The second point that I wish to share with the House is on illicit financial flows.  Madam Speaker, illicit financial flows are hemorrhaging this economy.  It is estimated that Zimbabwe is losing US$100 million every month to this vice.  The recent case of two Chinese nationals who were arrested in Zambia for gold and cash smuggling was deeply concerning.  These nationals were only apprehended in Zambia and had already left Zimbabwe without being detected.  We need political will to deal with these issues and to ensure that Zimbabweans derive maximum benefit from their resources.  I thought the fiscal policy review ought to have paid attention to this scourge. 

         The third point that I wish to bring to your attention Madam Speaker is that, in my view, the Finance Bill must be presented to Parliament first before being implemented.  Some of the measures came into effect before they were debated and passed by this Parliament.  My understanding is that, Parliament has the power of the pace and to make laws.  I am of the view that the Minister must respect this.       

A case in point is the duty for transit fuel that came into force before this House considered it.  This is in addition to the issues that have already been raised around these anti-business effects in terms of this policy.

         The final issue that I wish to raise to the House is on issues of over expenditure.  The issue of ministries that have exhausted their budgets six months into the year is concerning and we will need explanations and clarifications from the relevant minister on what he is proposing in terms of where additional resources will come from and whether a supplementary budget is needed.  This must also be obviously done without prejudicing social service ministries.  I thank you.

         HON. MATINENGA:  Thank you Madam Speaker for the opportunity.  I stand to add my voice to the Mid-Term Report which was presented by the Minister of Finance, Economic Development and Investment Promotion.  I concur with the presentation that was made by the Chairman of the Budget, Finance and Economic Development Committee in respect of a number of issues and the comments and recommendations that were made by Hon. Members.  I would like to buttress, in a very few minutes, on a few issues.

         On the issue of the fiscalised machines, it was recommended by Hon. Members that these machines should be made available.  It is a reality that sometimes, it is a problem for entrepreneurs to access these machines.  On a number of occasions, the Minister of Finance, Economic Development and Investment Promotion mentioned that they are flexible and willing to listen to the concerns of the public.

         On the issue of Intermediated Money Transfer Tax (IMTT), in this august House, it was actually mentioned that they will continuously monitor the situation of intermediate tax because this is causing a lot of problems and may, actually be jeopardising our revenue collection because on a number of occasions, if you go into shops, you are told the machines are not working because they want cash.  So, I think, the Hon. Minister should continuously check so that, at least, they can modify and maybe reduce the IMTT so that it is affordable and encouraging entrepreneurs to use the banking sector.

         I also want to recommend to the Minister of Finance, Economic Development and Investment Promotion on the need for institutions like ZIMRA to expand their training programmes, in terms of awareness, to the general public.  There are a lot of new issues pertaining to how the Quarterly Payment Dates (QPDs) should be paid and even the exemptions on VAT and the presumptive tax – all these things are very technical.  The public needs to be made aware.  Yes, they are doing something but you need to expand so that the businessmen in the rural areas and growth points are also made aware of what is happening.  This can be done through the use of pamphlets that can be distributed to the rural areas.  The material can also be put on WhatsApp so that no one is left behind in terms of that knowledge.  They say that ignorance is no defence but let us try to ensure that everyone is aware of what is happening so that you do not end up punishing them unnecessarily.  

         Lastly, I would like to urge the Hon. Minister to continuously review the list of sectors reserved for Zimbabweans as recommended by colleagues who spoke before me so that you are giving priority to the Zimbabwean sector.  I so submit Madam Speaker Ma’am.

         HON. MUTIMBANYOKA:  Good afternoon, Madam Speaker Ma’am.  I would like to commend and praise the Hon. Minister of Finance, Economic Development and Investments Promotion and his team for coming up with a well-thought out Mid-Term Fiscal Policy Statement which went in with all prescribed measures to support and sustain the stability ushered by our structured currency, the Zimbabwe Gold. 

         Madam Speaker Ma’am, I would also want to give the Hon. Minister a pat at the back for his timeous intervention and response to external shocks such as the El Nino induced drought and depressed commodity prices gripping the economy whilst threatening the recovery progress being spearheaded by the champion of development, our President, His Excellency Cde. Dr. Mnangagwa – [HON. MEMBERS: Hear, hear.]-

         I also noticed with delight, the positive change of attitude on our people towards our new currency.  The confidence index is at its all-time high.  The previous disposition to offload the local currency at every opportunity in preference to the greenback which was binding itself as well as feeding the black market is slowly dissipating with the setting in of stability.

         Madam Speaker Ma’am, we need to collectively work together in coming up with realistic measures to drive and create a natural demand for ZiG.  We need to work together to contain and curtail monetary expansion and we also need to work together to foster judicious management of liquidity.  Everyone is important and, therefore, we need all hands-on deck and I thus I appeal to the Hon. Minister, to always come to the House for guidance and strategy formulation.

         I would like to add another accolade to the Hon. Minister’s cap for his commitment to resisting any and every temptation to monetise the budget deficit and any related headwinds as this has an adverse effect of reversing all the positive fights and gains, we have achieved so far.  It is important to note that real and permanent stability will only come through and will be driven by production and productivity.  The Hon. Minister being the man entrusted with the enormous responsibility through the investment promotion arm of this portfolio, must work all out in ensuring that he attracts meaningful investments into the country. 

In conclusion Madam Speaker Ma’am, the Mid-Term Budget Review highlighted and confirmed that the inflationary pressures have cooled off, stability has set-in and the exchange volatility has reduced quite significantly following the introduction of the structured currency.  I, therefore, urge the Chief Exchequer to continue monitoring and evaluating all interventions to protect and preserve the gains achieved thus far.   I so submit Madam Speaker Ma’am. 

THE MINISTER OF FINANCE, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND INVESTMENT PROMOTION (HON. PROF. M. NCUBE):  Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  If I can proceed perhaps to respond to the wonderful contributions that we have received from our Hon. Members.  It has been an incredible debate indeed and I appreciate all the comments, questions they have raised, and issues where they needed clarification. 

Let me start with the presentation by the Chairperson of the Committee on Finance, Economic Development and Investment Promotion, Hon. Chiduwa.  In that report – the first issue he dealt with had to do with the VAT exemption on cattle, pigs, goats, sheep bovine, semen kapenta and poultry meat.  He applauded the Government for exempting VAT on cattle, pigs, goats, sheep, bovine, semen kapenta and poultry meat. 

We had to do this Madam Speaker because we realised that while the policy sought to raise additional revenue, it was becoming very disruptive to that market and we thought that this should be reversed.  So, it had created more negative effects in the economy and was causing informalisation in the meat sector where formal abattoirs were now being by-passed.  We felt that this was not progressive at all.  We thought that the best thing to do is to reverse the VAT requirements for this sector.  So, he was, I think, happy with that move and we thank him for that accolade.Let me turn to the issue of duty on fuel in transit.  Hon.  Members have raised an issue.  As you are aware, there have been high incidents of transit fraud whereby goods imported under the removal in transit facility are offloaded on to the local market without payment of adequate duty.

         Madam Speaker, Hon. Chiduwa recommended the removal of duty on this transit fuel.  However, I wish to highlight that the policy already is bearing fruit and ZIMRA has done a good job in setting up an efficient refund mechanism through dedicated bank accounts where they are able to refund any operators speedily upon exit in our borders.  This policy has also increased the usage of the pipeline from an average upliftment of 6.8 million litres to 8.1 million litres of fuel per day and this was a desired objective of this policy as well.

         It should be noted that fuel uplifted for export has increased from 1.5 million litres to 2.5 million litres per day. We also got some submissions, Madam Speaker.  Some Hon. Members did mention that perhaps this is violating some CFTA, international treaties around trade and so forth. This is not the case because what is happening here is that someone is paying duty upon entry and then receiving a rebate upon exit, clearly that duty is not being retained, and it is not being taxed.  Rather, it is a temporary mechanism to ensure compliance that indeed the fuel or whatever good it is will exit the country.  If not, then duty will be paid.  So l do not think this undermines our commitments to the African Continental Free Trade Area at all.  In fact, it is neutral in term of that objective.

Let me turn to the issue or presumptive tax.  Madam Speaker, I would like to thank Hon. Madzivanyika for applauding the new measures of paying the presumptive taxes in local currency and others have done the same, thank you very much, as well as the reduction in presumptive taxes in the first place.

On the issue of pegging the local currency tax tables in foreign currency, which Hon. Madzivanyika mentioned, I wish to advise that our local currency has been largely stable and therefore pegging local currency or rather producing tables in local currency or in foreign currency is neither here nor there.  I think what is important here is stability and that is what we aim to achieve.  I do not think we should be overly concerned about that one but we hear him non-the-less.

Hon. Madzivanyika also raised the issue of auditing our reserves at the Central Bank to check whether we have got adequate reserves to support our currency or not.  Here I hasten to say look, Members of Parliament are free to take an inspection at the Central Bank to really check that the gold that we say is there is indeed there.  There is no issue here.  Hon. Members are free to visit the Central Bank to have a look and instead we should make an invitation to the Committee, at least to visit and take a look.  There is no problem there.

In terms of audit issues, we can produce two audits per annum.  There is no difficulty.  When we do the mid-term monetary statement halfway through the year and at the end of the year, we have to do an audit anyway.  We can produce audit figures for that.  What I can say as of now is that the reserves backing the currency amount to about US$365 million and that figure will be maintained right through the year without difficulty.  We have adequate reserves to support the currency and in fact we had already started a programme through the Central Bank, where some of the reserves have been liquidated in order to fund foreign currency requirements in the market.  I can give further detail, but I think that I should not speak too much ahead of the Central Bank.  Some of these things are best left to the central bank.  They can articulate these things much better as it is their mandate, but I can assure you that some of the reserves are being used to support the currency and that is what they are there for.  So, we have adequate reserves.  Hon. Madzivanyika you should not be worried about whether we have enough or not.

Then an issue that was raised by Hon. Nyabani regarding support for indigenous businesses.  Are we doing enough as Government, should we be doing more?  We have had a programme that we have put in place to support the indigenous businesses.  First of all, every year we set aside resources to capacitate the development finance arm of the Industrial Development Corporation (IDC).  The aim here is to do exactly that which is to support investment into our corporate sector and here we expect indigenous business people to benefit from it. Female indigenous business people also have access to resources from the Women’s Bank.  Those who are youthful also have access to resources from Empower Bank. 

In the National Venture Fund, and I am pleased that eventually they will be able to find a CEO who is going to champion the objectives of that institution.  Again, this institution, the National Venture Fund is able to support indigenous businesses through the provision of what we call patient capital.  They are able to take equity in a business for five up to seven years. Who knows; and we will have an arrangement to sell back their sells to the project promoter so that we do not introduce inadvertently, other shareholders into the business.  This gives the indigenous business person what we call patient capital as opposed to surviving on an overdraft facility, which is very difficult to run a start-up business.

Let me turn to the issue of debt which has been raised by several contributors in this House starting obviously with Hon. Chiduwa who raised it.  First of all, he said we needed a debt sustainability strategy that should be presented here in Parliament.  I commit that we will do that during the presentation of the November 2025 budget, which will be presented at the end of November this year, but let me hasten to say that the comments which have come from several contributors that our debt levels are high, they are unsustainable and so forth.  Zimbabwe really does not suffer from a debt sustainability problem in terms of quantum if you look at the quantum of debt at the moment at US$21 billion looking at a conservative GDP level of US$35 billion that amounts to just over 60% give and take. 

In fact, our precise debt to GDP ratio is actually 68%.  So really that is within the SADC target of 70%.  It is within our own public debt management target threshold of 70%.  We have stayed within that target.  So we do not have debt susceptibility challenges in terms of quantum.  The issue has been the liquidity to service that debt because we have so many demands and not being able to access credit lines offshore easily and other credit lines domestically.  We have liquidity challenges.  So that is the issue but not in terms of quantum. 

Going forward, we have every intention to restructure the debt.  We are going to restructure the debt to make sure that we can create enough fiscal space to be able to service that debt adequately.  We are working on the plan right now.  In the next few weeks, it should be ready and we will start implementing.  So, if we request some of the creditors to take deep hair cuts and they come running to you, we are aware that some of them do come to our Hon. Members and seek an ear and so forth.  Please do not entertain them.  Allow us to do our work.

If I can now turn to an issue raised again by Hon. Madzivanyika.  He had a long contribution, that is why he raised a lot of points and I appreciate that so that we can then have the opportunity to clarify.  He raised an issue about the valuation of Kuvimba, that the implied valuation of Kuvimba was US$4.5 billion.  He is correct.  That is the valuation that Mutapa was able to furnish us with when they did their transaction for the 35% equity.  This valuation is backed by the assets that are within that group, which range from the platinum, lithium, gold assets and so forth.  There is quite a variety of minerals in there, subsidiaries and the value came up to about US$4.5 billion which then is in line with what Mutapa paid off the shareholders of that 35% and acquired 100% of the equity in Kuvimba.

         There is a loan agreement regarding the loan agreement between the Central Government through the Treasury and Mutapa regarding the capitalisation of Mutapa and Mutapa has to pay back that loan.  The loan arrangement says that any sale of assets by Mutapa ought to go towards extinguishing that loan as a priority.

         Turning to the low expenditures that were highlighted again by one or two Members regarding for instance the Ministry of Primary and Secondary Education, I must hasten to say that we are aware that the Ministry, not just them but other Ministries as well, do have absorptive capacity issues in terms of the usage of budget.  As Treasury, we have set up a structure in which I have asked my Deputy Minister of Finance, Hon. D. Mnangagwa to co-chair with the Deputy Minister of Primary and Secondary Education.  We have set up this structure that this Ministry, the Ministry of Defense, for example, Hon. D. Mnangagwa co-chairs processes of budget implementation with Hon. Gen. Mayihlome for the Ministry of Defence.

We also have similar arrangements with the Ministry of Agriculture and the Hon. Deputy Minister co-chairs that committee with Hon. Haritatos and so forth.  So, we are trying to establish that arrangement for various Ministries where we feel either they are high budget utilisation Ministries like the Ministry of Agriculture or their slow absorptive capacity, which means they need support.  We believe that through this process, we will be able to deal with some of these issues around low-budget utilisation.

         Let me turn to the school feeding programme and I am pleased Madam Speaker, there was a very robust debate earlier on which the relevant ministries responded, the Ministry of Primary and Secondary Education but mainly the Minister responsible for Social Welfare about some of these issues.  The Government policy position is that all schools are required to implement a home-grown school feeding programme and are guided by the Secretary’s Circular 5 of 2019. 

         In case of non-compliance, the Minister of Primary and Secondary Education has set up command centres for such reports to be made and followed up.  On the ongoing food deficit mitigation strategy, the school feeding programme was also incorporated under the emergency school feeding grain programme as at 9 September 2024 out of the required 27,7 metric tonnes of grain, 2,8 metric tonnes had been distributed to 9 provinces. So, this is tracked carefully and every week we receive reports through the Ministry of Social Welfare in Cabinet on progress in terms of grain distribution and the support for our children in the schools.

         Further to the above Provincial Education Directors in their district school’s inspectorate have been mandated to assist heads of schools who need capacity development to effectively provide daily school meals at all learning institutions.

         Let me turn to the Council of Chiefs.  It was again an issue raised by Hon. Madzivanyika why the Council of Chiefs has exceeded their budget utilisation by 100% and this is before year-end.  I must say it should be noted that the Council of Chiefs incurred excess expenditures on their vote due, in part, to the unbudgeted procurement of 237 vehicles for Chiefs as well as the review of allowances and other related national events.  However, the vehicles were the bulk of this expenditure. These are tools of trade. They ought to be able to move around to attend to their constituencies and they need to be mobile.  So, this is important but unfortunately, it was way above their budget but we were able to cover for it as Treasury through the unallocated reserves.

         Let me turn to the broad blame on the ministries which had exhausted their budgets.  A question again was raised by Hon. Madzivanyika about ministries that had exhausted their budget and how they will survive up to year-end considering that there is no supplementary budget for this year.  Madam Speaker Ma’am the conversion of the 2024 Budget from ZWL to ZiG has resulted in most line ministries restoring their budget capacity which can take them up to year-end, either some ministries that would have exhausted their full budget, Treasury will utilise and are utilising the unallocated reserve transfer to support disbursements up to year-end.  One ministry, for example, is the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructure Development because of the road development programme which we had to speed up because of the imperatives of the SADC Summit they overshot their budget.  So, we had to support them through the unallocated reserve transfer.

         Let me turn to a question that was raised by Hon. Kapoikulu regarding the funding for the City of Bulawayo.  That is a specific question, Madam Speaker.  He raised an important issue regarding the funding of the City of Bulawayo to improve access to water and sanitation services.  I am aware that it has been brought to light a little bit because it veered into areas that were not part of the Mid-Term Budget Review.  However, my team still felt that we needed to address these concerns so I am going to do that. 

         He noted the water challenges being experienced in the City of Bulawayo.  The Government has appointed a technical committee to work on the possible remedies for addressing water and sanitation challenges for the city.  To kick start the process, the Government availed an equivalent of US$1 million targeting the following projects: - the Inyankuni Pump Station upgrade covering the procurement of two additional pumps and a transformer and some civil works.  Number two, we used this also to deal with the Umzingwane Pump Station where there was reconfiguring the existing pipeline to allow the water to get to the treatment plant in increase volume. The implementation of the aforementioned projects is currently ongoing with pumps for Inyankuni Station now already in the country and awaiting installation.

         The City of Bulawayo is currently working on the awarding of the contract for some of the additional works for the above-mentioned two projects.  Treasury has already disbursed an additional US$1.5 million based on the engineers' estimate to improve operational efficiency for the identified two projects.  Whilst the contracts for the additional works on the already targeted projected are awarded it is our view that they are already disbursed resources by Treasury will cover the targeted works up to year end.

         Part of the already availed resources will also be earmarked for the renewal of our water mains, replacement of valves and metres to reduce the non-revenue water, and increase water supply to residents. 

         Let me turn to an important issue raised by Hon. Mamombe regarding transparency, accountability, and anti-corruption measures.  Her request was could I present a list of measures that we are taking or will be taking to improve our response to corruption issues.

         Madam Speaker Ma’am Hon. Mamombe raised the issue of transparency and accountability as well as anti-corruption measures.  May I highlight that the Government has set up the following organisations and capabilities to deal with this issue. First of all within Treasury, we created the Central Internal Audit Unit with the aim of improving transparency and accountability in the use of Government resources in running Government programmes.

         In addition to this, we also introduced the value for money concept where we interrogate every contract that comes through Government to make sure that these are indeed value for money and there is no overpricing. We have also given additional capacity to the Zimbabwe Anti-Corruption Commission as you can see, they have been busy. They are even telling us how many public officials have been corrupt and so forth. So, they are on top of the situation and they have given us information as to where the problems lie.

         We also have the Financial Intelligence Unit and we have given them additional capacity to deal with money laundering and issues around elicit financial flows. We have been very supportive of the office of the Auditor General to audit the line ministries, agencies and departments and they have dutifully produced various reports on their findings. As Government, we have a duty to follow up on their findings to make sure we plug the holes and improve transparency and accountability and deal with some of the corruption. Government working through the Financial Intelligence Unit has also blacklisted some of the companies which have been diverting funds at the parallel market. Those we consider to be some illicit financial flows.

I would also like to thank Hon. Mutodi for complementing the fiscalisation of fuel programme, the use of local currency to pay for various fees and services and the reduction in the presumptive taxes and the ongoing infrastructure problems. He urged us that we must continue to do more. I would like to advise the House that we are working close with the Reserve Bank of Zimbabwe in ensuring that the bureau-de-changes work effectively in meeting the foreign exchange requirements for everybody who needs foreign currency.

I also like to thank Hon. Ndudzo for again complementing our efforts in improving our score and position in the open budget survey. Zimbabwe improved from a ranking of 59 out of 100 in 2021 to 63 out of 100 in 2024. We will endeavour to continue improving our rank. We take this very seriously. At the moment, No. 1 country is South Africa and No. 2, is Benin and No. 3, is in Zimbabwe. We have come a long way in the last five years to be in this position and we will continue to do better.

This speaks to budget transparency and accountability and we thank Hon. Members of this august House for their role in making sure that our budget is transparent and there is a sense of accountability. Regarding the issue of selling fuel in local currency, I wish to advise that fuel is an important commodity and currently, if you look at our foreign exchange system, if you speak to various players, they will tell you that we are struggling to access foreign currency and many times it is difficult. At the same time, there is two and a half billion USD that is sitting in the banks.

Imagine now if you say fuel should be sold in local currency, will the fuel importers be able to access foreign currency easily. I think we will put a lot of pressure on our forex management system and before you know it, you will have queues of fuel all over again and we have to get rid of those queues by making sure that fuel can be sold in USD. It being an imported commodity, I still feel that the current system where fuel is sold in USD is the best way to go and it is the best way for the industry to access foreign currency in order to keep importing and then selling and the cycle keeps going.

However, over time, I foresee us moving gradually towards more fuel being sold in domestic currency and as we begin to accept our local currency more, we begin to claw back on the use of the USD.

Madam Speaker Ma’am, I agree with Hon. Ndudzo that Government should capacitate its workers in order to reduce reliance on consultancy. I wish to advise that Government is doing a lot already in terms of capacitating civil servants to do what they do.

I now turn to the contributions by Hon. Tshuma who again was applauding the fiscalisation programme on the fuel sector. He was concerned about the availability of the fiscalisation devices and I can assure him that we are working with ZIMRA to make sure that we deal with this matter.

         ZIMRA has also become innovative and they are able now to connect businesses directly to their system so that we by-pass the fiscal machines and they are able to connect electronically. This will go a long way in dealing with this bottleneck of the availability of fiscal devices.

Hon. Tshuma also mentioned a very important point with regards to including quarry mining as part of those reserve sectors for indigenous business people. I must say that we feel supportive of this suggestion and if the House does not object perhaps, we should consider adding quarry mining and crushing to the list of reserved sectors for indigenous citizens.

         Let me turn to the contribution by Hon. Fred Moyo. I really enjoyed his exposition regarding the mining sector. He made three points. One was that the mining sector can become a force for industrialisation. I agree with him because our insisting that there should be beneficiation is the way to go. If you take for example the iron ore mining project in Manhize, it is no longer just a mining project. It is an industrial project because the output is pig iron, carbon steel at the end of the day and that is manufacturing and this is the way to go. So, we have been insisting on beneficiation and this is what will drive industrialisation. I agree with him on this one.

         He felt that I needed to say more in my statement about the mining sector. I think he is right, I could have said more. I have got no difficulty here. However, there is an important point that he makes, which is very critical about whether we should be worrying so much about the prices obtaining out there as opposed to the cost structure for the various minerals. He is correct that we should focus on the cost structure, whether the mine has got low cost, medium cost or high cost mine. We have noticed this ourselves.

So, as I speak, our macroeconomic team is in Mutare retreating, working on these major mines and then comparing this cost structure to the prices in a fair view as to how much the mining sector can give us in terms of revenue and economic growth. He mentioned one issue that left me slightly disturbed, but it is a fact. It is a fact that our lithium sector is not the most competitive in the world because we are a high-cost producer in terms of classification of the various types of producers. So, there it is, we are high-cost producers and it is an issue for our lithium sector.

         THE MINISTER OF FINANCE (Spk..) I think we will engage the Chamber of Mines to understand more, as to whether we can do anything as Government.  Whether it is incentives or whatever it is, because we would like every one of our sub-sectors in the mining sector to be productive and be competitive.

         Let me turn to Hon. S. Ziyambi, who noted the improvement in revenue collections and also improvement in the budget utilisation. The run rate at 44% compared to 82% in 2023.  It really comes out right but he requested that again we need a plan for debt reduction.  I have already committed that by November, we will be able to share a debt reduction plan; a debt restructuring plan. He also highlighted the need to support various MDAs in terms of expenditure and so forth.  He raised a few points which we will take on board as we implement this year’s budget as some of the measures.

         Let me turn to Hon. Hlatwayo, who again highlighted the issue of our debt levels.  She mentioned that our debt stock is 96% of the GDP.  Honourable, it is not this high, if I can correct her, it is not 96%, it is 68%.  It is within the SADC Targets of 70% and within the Public Debt Management Act; our own target of 70%.  Our issue has been the liquidity to meet the tax repayment, that is issue as opposed to the quantum of the debt stock.  She also highlighted an important issue of illicit financial flows out of the country.  A figure of USD100 million a month or so, I do not know if per month or year but a large figure.  We are also concerned that is why we have the Financial Intelligence Unit (FIU) and we asked them to deal with this issue of illicit financial flows. 

         You will recall that a few years ago, we were under the grey list and we have since come out of that grey list because we have taken certain measures to deal with these illicit financial flows.  The FIU working with the Anti-Corruption Commission, the police and the Central Bank; there is a Committee that I start up to deal with these illicit financial flows, in line with the requirements from the financial global taskforce, illicit flows. 

Then the issue of duty on fuel, I just want to say that we believe that this policy is working. We would like Hon. Hlatwayo to be supportive and this allow us to implement it.  If we feel that the policy may be is not as effective, in some future, we will be the first admit, hopefully we can look at other options to deal with this issue. It is an issue, this issue of transit fuel.

         Let me turn to Hon. Matinenga, who basically mentioned that she agreed with the sentiments expressed by the Chair of the Budget and Finance Committee, Hon. Chiduwa.  Her key issue was to do with fiscalisation machines, where she mentioned that the machine should be made available.  I have already said that ZIMRA is trying its best and also has come up with innovative ways to allow businesses to connect virtually through their system, onto the ZIMRA systems and by-pass the need for a physical gadget. Then she mentioned the issue of IMTT, I know there is another Hon. Member who mentioned it that this is perhaps maintaining some burden to businesses.  Look, our view as Treasury is that this is a very efficient way to collect taxes.  It does let in quite cross-sectional players in the market and we think that it should be maintained.  Of course, over time we can trick and make some adjustments but it is a very efficient way to implement taxes.

         Let me now turn to Hon. Mutimbanyoka, again he was very complimentary of the way Treasury economic team has responded to certain shock; to certain imperatives on the economy.  We thank him for that appreciation.  It is not very often that Treasury teams anywhere in the world get appreciated and then look for the support for the new currency but of course, we need to stay vigilant stay the course and make sure that we do everything to keep the economy going and maintain this sterling rate of growth, something we have achieved despite all these pressures post Covid.

         I think I have really tried hard to cover as much as possible in terms of what Hon. Members raised.  I want to go back to some of the responses.  Hon. Ndudzo raised an issue regarding review of remuneration for civil servants.  We are currently in conversation through our negotiating platform, the NJNC, with the employees for some adjustments to their salaries.  This is going to be agreed soon, so we are dealing with it.  There is an issue raised by Hon. Tshuma on quarry mining and crushing.  Also, there is another matter, Hon. Madzivanyika raised a lot of issues.  He said that the decrease in inflows from Value Added Tax (VAT) collection, is a cause for concern.  This is explained by informalisation.  We are aware of this that informalisation is having an impact on VAT collections and we have sought to make sure that the informal sector pays what is due to Caesar.  It is not that easy to tax the informal sector but that is the reason why our VAT collections have been coming down. 

         On programme based budget, again Hon. Madzivanyika raised a lot of issues.  I also take note that he is a former ZIMRA employee.  He raised an issue regarding programme based budgeting.  He feels that maybe we should dispense with it.  I would say no, we should not dispense with it. Let us keep it.  I think he has the impression that perhaps the Treasury dictates as to which programmes we should finance. That is not the case.  The Ministries determine what ought to be financed.  They set up the programmes.  It is their choice; it is not our choice as Treasury.  I want to assure you that, he should not be fearful, programme based budgeting is a good thing for fiscal discipline.  It has put us where we are in terms of fiscal discipline. Madam Speaker, I think I have covered a lot of ground.  I thank the Hon. Members for their contributions.

HON. JAMES: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I request some clarity on the Kuvimba Mining House. The Hon. Minister mentioned that Government had purchased the remaining 35% shareholding, to now have a 100% of the shareholding. Sometime ago 12.5% was given to the Commercial Farmers Union and then President was put on the board. I am to presume that Mr. Pascal is still on the board and if a few have been paid as 12.5% shareholding. Thank you.

         HON. PROF. NCUBE: Hon. James has asked a very important question about the shareholding of the former farm owners on Kuvimba. They hold shares in Kuvimba and Government has donated these shares as part of the compensation mechanism to pay the farmers $3.5 billion that we agreed to pay under our global compensation deed. Yes, the board member, as far as I know is still on the board. I do not want to mention their names because they are not in Parliament but the board member from the farmers is still on the board as far as I know. They have not been removed and the shares owned by the farm owners are still intact and they are free to dispose of those shares at a moment of their choosing. It is actually their prerogative and their right. So, I can assure you Hon. James that, that shareholding is intact and secure.  I thank you.

         An Hon. Member having wanted to raise a point of privilege.

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER: (HON. MAUNGANIDZE): Hon. Members, I think the Minister has responded and has exhausted all important issues – [HON MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – I do not think there is any other issues that need clarity.

HON. MADZIVANYIKA:  On a point of privilege Madam Speaker.

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER:  What is your point of privilege Hon. Madzivanyika.

HON. MADZIVANYIKA: Thank you Madam Speaker. I seek with your indulgence, if leave be granted that the Hon. Minister responds to the question raised by Hon. Hlatywayo, to the effeact that where does he derive the power to authorise operationalisation of proposed Finance Bill items, for example the RAT issue? It was operational from the 1^st of August, yet we have not debated it and authorised as Parliament. Thank you very much – [HON MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER: Order. What is your point of clarity?

HON. DR. KHUPE: The Hon. Minister raised the issue of the informal sector. This is very important because Zimbabwe is highly informalised with more than 80% of those people being women. The Minister said the informal sector is supposed to be paying taxes, but I think the first thing that the Minister has to do is to make sure that the informal sector is funded, so that they stop being a supermarket of other countries and start producing and exporting goods.

They are going to buy clothes and food stuffs which they can easily produce in this country if they are fully supported and funded. I request the Minister that the Women’s Bank makes sure that women have access to capital and the Youth Empowerment Bank, that the youths have access to capital, so that they are able to produce and export their goods. That is the only way we can get new money because Minister, this country requires new money.

Money is getting out of the country, US dollars are getting out of the country and they bring goods to collect more money and take it outside. This country requires new money and new money can only be generated if the informal sector is properly funded so that they start producing and stop being a supermarket of other countries.

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER:  Thank you Hon. Member. I am not going to take any more issues after the Minister has responded. I think he has exhausted all critical issues.

THE MINISTER OF FINANCE, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND INVESTMENT PROMOTION (HON. PROF. M. NCUBE): Thank you very much Madam Speaker Ma’am. I thank Hon. Khupe for her contribution as to how perhaps to capacitate the Women’s Bank to support SMEs. I agree with her and we have taken note. I also took note of the comments from Hon. Madzivanyika. Thank you very much. Madam Speaker, I move that the debate do now adjourn.

Motion put and agreed.

Debate to resume: Thursday, 12^th September, 2024.

On the motion of THE MINISTER OF FINANCE, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND INVESTMENT PROMOTION (HON. PROF. M. NCUBE), the House adjourned at Twenty-Seven Minutes to Seven o’clock p. m.