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NATIONAL ASSEMBLY HANSARD 13 OCTOBER 2022 VOL 48 NO 84

          PARLIAMENT OF ZIMBABWE

Thursday, 13th October, 2022.

The National Assembly met at a Quarter-past Two O’clock p.m.

PRAYERS

(THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair)

ANNOUNCEMENTS BY THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER

PETITIONS RECEIVED FROM CHIPO JIRI, THE WOMEN’S LAW IN SOUTHERN AFRICA AND RESIDENTS OF EIFFEL BLUE CHEMUKUTE TOWNSHIP AND PARK TOWN

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  I have to inform the House that on Monday 3rd October, 2022, Parliament received a petition from Chipo Jiri of Zororo Bar, beseeching Parliament to call upon Harare City Council to provide access to decent accommodation or shelter to families currently residing at the disused Zororo Bar.  The petition has since been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Local Government, Public Works, National Housing and Social Amenities. 

          I also have to inform the House that on Monday 3rd October 2022, Parliament of Zimbabwe received a petition from the Women’s Law in Southern Africa beseeching Parliament to amend the electoral law and Political Parties Finance Act to provide for the allocation of funds for campaigning and provision of training for women candidates for election.  The petition has since been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Justice, Legal and Parliamentary Affairs. 

In addition, on Tuesday 4th October 2022, Parliament of Zimbabwe received a petition from the residents of Eiffel Blue Chemukute Township and Park Town in Kadoma beseeching Parliament to protect the Constitution and the rights of residents of Eiffel Flats by ensuring that the environmental damage caused by mining activities is mitigated, the health of citizens protected and to ensure that residents are allocated and fairly compensated for their properties. The petition has since been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Mines and Mining Development.

          HON. A. NDEBELE: On a point of privilege Madam Speaker.

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: What is your point of privilege?

          HON. A. NDEBELE: Thank you Madam Speaker.  My point of privilege is that there is a report that is before this House by the Parliamentary Committee on Youth, Sports, Arts and Recreation that among other recommendations, seeks to direct the Sports and Recreation Commission to reinstate the recalled ZIFA board members led by former President, Mr. Felton Kamambo. The report is entitled ‘The State of Football Administration in Zimbabwe’.  Madam Speaker, from the outset, I wish to agree and reiterate sentiments expressed by members of this House that the report is biased.  I will quickly get into that and it becomes a matter of privilege for all of us who are members of this House.

          Madam Speaker, I wish to officially invite a reaction from your Chair to set up a Privileges Committee that will put a number of things to test with respect to the Committee or some of its members if you want. Madam Speaker, I wish to state that some members of the Committee that brought this report are pushing for the reinstatement of the said football board are conflicted in the entire saga. Points of interest for your attention Madam Speaker, without wasting your time that I want tested so that we preserve the integrity of this House as well as the integrity of that particular committee. This process is too pronged. It will either save the face of the committee when it has been put to test as well as save our face.

Madam Speaker, is the chairperson of this committee one of the few beneficiaries of grassroots sports equipment donated to him by the same executive committee that they want reinstated at ZIFA House? If so, is he not conflicted?ouHoH If the Chairperson himself is a beneficiary, did he declare this apparent conflict of interest and why did he not find it prudent to recuse himself from the committee proceedings for the sake of transparency? Third and lastly Madam Speaker, the committee relies almost entirely and heavily so on a dossier. They speak of a dossier...

The Minister of Justice, Legal and Parliamentary Affairs having approached the Chair.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Ndebele, remember it has to be one minute.

HON. NDEBELE: This is of national interest but I am rising on 7 (2) (d), privilege. So if the Minister is the one who shared that we need to correct him as the Leader of Government Business – [THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): Inaudible interjection.] – But you do not speak to me directly. You speak to me via Madam Speaker.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Ndebele, please may you wind up?

 HON. NDEBELE: I am winding up Madam Speaker. The entire report leans heavily on a dossier.

THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): On a point of order Madam Speaker. Those are points to debate about the report that was tabled. He got an opportunity in the Committee to raise the conflicts of interest, he did not and he wants the House to debate about what they debated in the committee. If as a member of the committee has points that he wants to debate about the report, he can then debate and criticise it but he cannot rise on a point of order when he is part of the Committee and he is bringing their divisions within the Committee to the august House. I move that we proceed with Government Business. I thank you.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please, may you approach the Chair Hon. Ndebele.

HON. NDEBELE: He made several wrong insinuations. I am not a Member of that Committee...

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Ndebele, may you approach the Chair – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –

HON. NDEBELE: I know its rumours. I am saying we must stop the report until a privileges committee has been set up – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – It is proper. I am in order, I know. I am not a Member of that Committee. He is making a misrepresentation. Therefore, I am rising to ask this House to set up a privileges committee. Madam Speaker, you are the one who is supposed to make a ruling on this...

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: I asked you to approach the Chair Hon. Ndebele. Please, may you approach the Chair?

HON. NDEBELE: This is not a village court. Hatisi kuPPC pano – [THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): You are totally lost.] – No, I am not. Ko warwadziwa nei?

Hon. Ndebele approached the Chair.

*HON. P. ZHOU: Thank you very much Madam Speaker. I rise on a point of national interest.

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order Hon. Members. Allow the Hon. Member to be heard in silence.

*HON. P. ZHOU: Thank you Madam Speaker for protecting me. I want to thank the Government for being able to prevent the loss of the winter wheat from quelea birds. Last year we had serious problems from this bird and we lost a lot of grain through millions of quelea birds that destroyed our wheat. Farmers were no longer sleeping because they would wake up early in the morning to go and blow vuvuzelas with their workers and were now behaving as noisy people but this year, we want to thank the Crop Protection Unit. Using the GPS technology, they were able to assist us to inform them about the quantities of the Bill that we had found. Last season, people got three to five tonnes per ha instead of eight tonnes. Invariably, these quelea birds can destroy 30% of your crop. I would like to thank the Government for its hard work. I want to also thank the Government for the producer price that it has set and a lot of farmers are happy. They would want the same extended to the unit price of maize. Thank you very much for the opportunity Madam Speaker. I thank you.

*HON. BITI: Thank you Madam Speaker. I rise on a point of national interest which pertains to the issue of special mining leases which are provided for under the Mines and Minerals Act, Chapter 21:03. These special mining leases in terms of Section 139 say these are huge investments that require a lot of money, say a minimum of US$100 million but you find that these special mining leases are now being granted to people that do not have money. They are now being distributed like cakes at a wedding. I am talking of the platinum leases like the one given to the Russian company, DGI which has stopped operating at the moment.

These special mining leases are now too numerous. Another example is that of Manhize in Chivi where there is mining of iron ore. Manhize was giving iron ore resources of 43 billion metric tonnes but no money has come to Zimbabwe. It hurts because we are mortgaging our country with these special leases and at the end of the day, Zimbabwe receives nothing. I request the Minister of Mines to come and give a statement on special mining leases that he has given from 2018 to date; how much money he has raised from them; what was the criteria used in awarding licences; what investments have been done by such mines and why he did not come before Parliament for us to be in a position to grant those mining leases because Zimbabwe is now being impoverished. I want Hon. Chitando to come and give us a report. Zimbabwe belongs to its own people and we should not sell it. Thank you.

*THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you Hon. Biti. We have heard you and the message will be conveyed to Hon. Chitando to come and make a Ministerial Statement in response to the issues you have raised – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –Order, order Hon. Members.

*HON. KASHIRI: Madam Speaker, I rise in this august House on a point of national interest requesting you and Zimbabweans at large to come and support our own local girl-child Kudakwashe Chivandire who will be in the boxing arena against a girl-child from Mexico. I urge that we all support in the spirit of the girl-child.  That was on a lighter note.

Time for one minute points of order was suspended in terms of Standing Order Number 62 (2)

MOTION

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): I move that Order of the Day, Number One be stood over until the rest of the Orders of the Day have been disposed of.

Motion put and agreed to.

MOTION

RATIFICATION OF THE AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE REPUBLIC OF ZIMBABWE AND THE REPUBLIC OF TURKEY ON TRADE AND ECONOMIC COOPERATION

Second Order read: Adjourned debate on motion on the Agreement between the Republic of Zimbabwe and the Republic of Turkey on Trade and Economic Cooperation.

Question again proposed.

HON. MPARIWA: Thank you Madam Speaker for giving me this opportunity to speak to this particular ratification tabled by the Minister. I note with amusement in terms of having this said document being ratified by Zimbabwe because if you see Madam Speaker, most of the goods we have in the country and the people that are going out to get goods to come and sell, especially women and the young people; everyone is flying to Turkey to get goods so that they resale. Most of the small shops around Third Street and Robert Mugabe, that very side, all the goods, handbags and so on, I was trying to do my shopping locally. You will find that most of the goods that are being sold there are coming from Turkey and I think this will be a good way in terms of promoting economic development and for the country to benefit from its own generation.  I hope and trust that we will be able to ratify more treaties so that we open up to more investors since Zimbabwe is open for business.  I would like to applaud the Minister for bringing this particular treaty to Parliament for ratification.  I thank you.

          HON. MADZIMURE:  Madam Speaker, I am in support of creating relationships with other governments but I have one issue which is that, we seem not to pay particular attention to the crucial issues when we negotiate these agreements.  What must come out of all these agreements is a two-way relationship where Zimbabwe benefits and the other country also benefits.  However, it is most important that we always look at our interests as a country.  If we look at the agreement and some of the issues in there, it allows trade to grow between us and Turkey but as alluded to by Hon. Mpariwa, we do not have quality goods that we are exporting to Turkey.  The agreement should be meant to develop our industry.  The agreement should open up the market for our industry.  Once we enter any agreement, we must concentrate on those small lines in the agreement that benefit individuals from Zimbabwe.  In this case I am referring to those industrialists.  It must allow our industrialists to learn from Turkey, import technology and equipment from Turkey.  Several agreements that we have entered into have opened Zimbabwe to those countries but Zimbabwe has not penetrated these markets because we do not pay attention to the details. 

In other countries, the moment an agreement is signed, a committee responsible for that particular agreement is set up to see how they will be going to benefit from the agreement?  In Zimbabwe, we do not have that.  The evidence is very clear and if you drive into our industrial areas at around 5 p.m. and wait to see how many people will be coming out of some of these complexes, there are very few people and it tells you that there is no production that is going on inside.  So, who is benefitting from all these several agreements that we have entered into?  We are not.  It must be reflected through the development of industry.  Right now if we look and ask each other where all we are wearing is coming from, do we have any local product, even the socks, we do not have.  This tie is from Turkey, China, India et cetera and there is no Zimbabwean product.  As a result, we are now doing running battles with the vendors in Mbare who are selling those clothes and our industry is not developing. 

My plea is that any agreement must be carefully looked into  in order to  take advantage of that agreement to exchange even technology itself with countries like Turkey.  What makes our clothes even expensive is the type of machines that we use.  We also do not have manpower that looks at the technology itself for a particular company and recommend and we are not preparing even our entrepreneurs for them to understand how to maximise even productivity itself.  My plea is that once we enter an agreement, we must follow it up after a certain period like two years.  The Minister must come back and say this agreement that I asked this House to ratify; this is how it has performed for the country and not just to ask us to ratify and it is filed and it becomes the end of that particular agreement.  I thank you Madam Speaker.

          THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI):  Thank you Madam Speaker Ma’am.  Firstly, I would like to thank the Hon. Members for the debate and the contributions.  I have taken note of some of the concerns raised that perhaps we need when these agreements are signed; one, a progress report on what benefits would be accruing to the country and I am pleased that the majority have supported the ratification of the agreement.  Having said that, I now move that this House resolves to ratify the agreement.

      Motion that:

WHEREAS Section 327 (2) (a) of the Constitution of Zimbabwe

provides that an international treaty which has been concluded or

executed or under the authority of the President does not bind

Zimbabwe until it has been approved by Parliament;

  AND WHEREAS the Agreement between the Republic of

 Zimbabwe and the Republic of Turkey on Trade and Economic Co-

operation was signed on 10th October, 2018, in Turkey, the Republic of Turkey ratified the Agreement on 7th April, 2022, in Ankara. Zimbabwe has not ratified the Agreement;

  AND WHEREAS the entry into force of this agreement is on the

date of receipt of the last written notification, by which the parties

notify each other through diplomatic channels, of the completion of

their internal legal procedures required for the entry into force;

  AND WHEREAS the Republic of Zimbabwe is desirous to ratify to the said Agreement:

  NOW, THEREFORE, in terms of Section 327 (2) (a) of the

Constitution of Zimbabwe, this House resolves that the aforesaid

Agreement be and is hereby approved for ratification, put and agreed to.

CONSIDERATION STAGE

PRIVATE VOLUNTARY ORGANISATION AMENDMENT BILL [H. B. 10A, 2012]

Amendments to Clauses 2, 3, New Clause 3 (a), Clause 4, Clause 5,

New Clause 6 (a), New Clause 6 (b), New Clause 6 (c), New Clause 6(d),  New Clause 6 (e), New Clause 9 (a), New Clause 9 (b), Clause 10, Clause 11…

(V)HON. MUSHORIWA:  Hon. Speaker, we did not hear the

Clerk.  What Order of the Day Number is that?

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  It is Order of the Day Number Three.

          New Clause 20, New Clause 21, New Clause 22, New Clause 23, New Clause 24, New Clause 25, New Clause 26, New Clause 27, New Clause 28, New Clause 29, New Clause 30, New Clause 31, New Clause 32, New Clause 33, New Clause 34 and New Clause 35 put and debate ensued.

          HON. BITI:  Madam Speaker Ma’am, we are aware that the Speaker has made a ruling on the issue of the Private Voluntary Organisation (PVO) Bill and the fact that when the Bill …

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  You are not connected.

          HON. BITI:  Madam Speaker when the Bill was committed to Committee Stage by the Hon. Minister of Public Service, Labour and Social Welfare, Hon. Prof. Mavima, there were Members who were on virtual who were denied the … - [HON. TOGAREPI: We cannot restart that, there was a ruling!] -  I am debating Hon. Speaker Ma’am and I stand protected.  My good friend has got a right to reply.

          Hon. Speaker Ma’am, there were people who were on virtual who were prevented from debating.  There were people who rushed into this House protesting the fact that they had been barred from debating and Hon. Mushoriwa was one of those people.  For me, what I found most disturbing and unacceptable was that the particular Minister chose a time and moment when he, for lack of a better word, sneaked debate on the PVO Bill when he knew that Hon. Members had not been placed on notice and were not in the House. 

          This is a Bill of national importance; this is a Bill with catastrophic ramifications.  So, on issues of procedure …- [HON. TOGAREPI: Inaudible interjection.] – Madam Speaker, I need protection from Hon. Pupurai.  He cannot make noise.  This is a chamber for debate and not for noise. If he has got anything to answer or to rejoin to what I am saying, you will give him an opportunity but he cannot, as it were, make noise.  He is a very experienced Member of Parliament.  So, the point I am submitting Madam Speaker Ma’am, is that on a question of procedure, this House has not followed its processes as defined in the Standing Orders.  Therefore, we should not expose ourselves to …

          HON. TOGAREPI:  On a point of order Madam Speaker! Madam Speaker, I think we are still following parliamentary processes and the Hon. Member cannot bring in new things when we are already at a certain stage and have gone past that stage.  We cannot do that.  Let us follow procedures. If he wants to debate, let him debate … - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – No, no, no he is not debating.  He wants to … - [HON. MEMBERS: He is debating!] – No, no, let us follow parliamentary processes.

          THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI):  Madam Speaker, my point of order is that this matter was raised in here and the Hon. Speaker made a ruling.  - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – And the Hon. Member wants you to make a ruling on a matter that was ruled; all the points that he raised - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – All the points that he raised, the Hon. Speaker made a ruling. – [HON. BITI: It is a preamble to my debate Madam Speaker.] –

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  Hon. Biti, I think you have to debate the - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – No, you are talking about the procedure - [*HON. BITI:  Madam Speaker, if you write a composition by Shakespeare at ‘O’ Level, you give an introduction.  This is an introduction and a preamble.  In Shona, it is called, ‘nhanga nyaya’!  This is Third Reading debate Madam Speaker Ma’am] – No, no, we do not have to debate about the procedure. We have to debate the clauses and not the procedure. – [HON. MEMBERS: We are not yet on Third Reading debate!] –

          HON. MADZIMURE:  On a point of order Madam Speaker!  Madam Speaker, it is clear that - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER:  Hon. Madzimure, I did not recognise you.  Please may you resume your seat! - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – Hon. Biti, please may you proceed but do not debate on procedure, debate on the clauses. – [HON. BITI:  I am now going to the clauses.] –

          HON. BITI:  Madam Speaker, we cannot surely sit as Parliament to legislate and curtail the rights of individuals and organisations.  Our Constitution gives rights to individuals, organisations and corporate bodies such as NGOs have got rights that are codified in Chapter Four (4) of the Constitution …

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order, order, your microphone is off.

          HON. BITI:  So, to allow the Executive to treat non-governmental organisations and private organisations that they can run, that they can control their affairs, that they can control their board at their whim is archaic.  This is 2022 not 1962 Southern Rhodesia. Four decades after independence, we cannot sit in this House to pass fascist laws – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –

          THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon. Biti, may you approach the Chair.

          Hon. Biti approached the Chair

HON. BITI: The provisions have the net effect of allowing the Government, the authorities to literally take over the existence of an NGO.  They allow the Minister under certain circumstances, to change the board of an NGO.  They allow an NGO’s books of accounts literally to be frozen.  They allow the NGO itself to be suspended under certain circumstances.

 We already have a judgment that came out in 1995; the judgment is called Sekai Holland vs Minister of Labour and Social Welfare.  The then Minister of Labour and Social Welfare was the late Nathan Shamuyarira and may his soul rest in peace.

Our Constitutional Court said a corporate organisation, whether it is a trust, an NGO, it is a human being.  Our Constitution in Sections 45 and 46 says, ‘there is no difference in the protection of rights between natural persons and non-natural person’s juristic persons’.  So, what we are doing in this Bill is to encroach on the rights of individuals and NGOs. Can you imagine a law that says Government can come into your House and look at what you have eaten, how you have slept, where you have slept?  It is not possible and where you are keeping your accounts; it is not possible.

 We have an obligation to protect the Constitution.  Section 119 (2) of the Constitution says this Parliament must protect and uphold the Constitution, particularly the bill of rights codified in Chapter 4 of the Constitution but we are passing a Bill Madam Speaker, the Government of Zimbabwe receives a minimum of a billion US dollars in overseas development assistance.  We receive at least 300 million US dollars from the US to deal with HIV/AIDS.  In fact, ironically, the biggest contributor of overseas development assistance in Zimbabwe is actually the United States of America, followed by the European Union, followed by DFID.  The bulk of this aid has nothing to do with what the Government is afraid of - human rights, democracy and so forth.  It is actually going to our people, going to irrigation projects in Nyanyadzi, going to the irrigation projects like Muchenje in Dotito, going to schools in the form of BEAM.  BEAM receives a substantial amount of money from overseas Development Assistance. 

So what we are doing is that we are cutting our noses in order to spite our faces.  This is a terrible Bill, a modern democratic Zimbabwe, 43 years after independence, cannot be passing such a Bill.  Herbert Chitepo, Ndabaningi Sithole, are turning in their graves, Edson Sithole, wherever they buried him, is turning in his grave, Joshua Mquabuko Nkomo who died on 1st July, 1999, is turning in this grave, Robert Mugabe who died on the 6th September, 2019, is turning in his grave. 

Madam Speaker, we should abandon this Bill, it is not in the best interest of the people of Zimbabwe.  It is not in the best interest of constitutionalism in Zimbabwe and we cannot pass a Bill to serve the interests of a political party that is paranoid.  I appeal to the Hon. Minister to withdraw this Bill – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –

HON. MARKHAM: Thank you Madam Speaker, I would like to add my voice to what has just been said. The original idea of this Bill was to clear the NGO and Trust issues; because we were in the grey area with the financial Action Task Force. While the Bill was coming to Parliament, we were taken off the Gray list and we were fine. Now, if that was the reason for this Bill to be brought to Parliament, why have we continued? The only debate particularly that from Government and obviously us, was for the softening of the words of this Bill, yet the Minister has made it even harder. So, what is the point of debating a Bill if you are not going to listen to the parliamentarians including your own people? We did consultations throughout this whole country and every one came through very strong for the benefits of the PVOs and Trusts. We ignored that, so why are we going for consultations? In fact, the Bill has changed so much that we went to them with the White Paper and we came with the Blue one to Parliament.

Madam Speaker, I wanted to debate this but I could not because apparently on Zoom, you do not have the same rights as a person sitting in this Parliament but I had to dress in my suit at home. The Minister himself is videoed telling you what to do and ignore the people on Zoom - that is shutting down democracy – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – Madam Speaker may I ask if the Hon. Leader of the House has got immunity because he is not being corrected at all?

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Please debate the clauses not the procedure.

HON. MARKHAM: I will go through a couple of clauses. Madam Speaker – [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] - I talk from some of the Trusts I am involved in and I would mention this, and the Minister is aware of this because I asked him. For wetlands for example, we want to add value for the value of the wetlands by buying. The reason for that is once you bought one, you can sell the carbon on credit and buy the next one. So you are adding value to the wetland and you are getting carbon credits regularly to buy more wetlands. The issue is this, this Bill allows you to kick out, even as a trustee, it allows you to take over the wetlands once they are bought on some whimsical assumption that we are politically orientated. Now I ask the question, who is going to invest money in a programme like that which will bring millions of dollars? Who would invest money when they cannot have a say as a trustee because it may be taken and where do they park their assets because they will just be taken? We have a record of just taking things in this country, farms included. So, my question is this on a PVO Bill- [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – It is not closed; you have not paid me. - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – Okay, he is still your Minister because he is signing documents. - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] – Tell your Minister, he is signing documents. Madam Speaker - [HON. MEMBERS: Inaudible interjections.] –

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order, may we have order please.

HON. MARKHAM: May I ask the reason why they are not protecting me?

THE HON. DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order, order, may we have order please!

HON. MARKHAM: Madam Speaker, let us talk about the clause where they are targeting and dealing with every PVO and trust the same way, if what the Minister says in his preamble that the reason is there are errant PVOs, why are they not being brought to book? Why are they not being targeted if they have got a 100 NGOs and one is misbehaving, why have they not been targeted? Could the Minister name one NGO that has been targeted or bought to book for either being political or for misusing money or for misrepresenting the facts? There are none, otherwise he would have done that. With insurance companies, we have issues with the insurance companies who run array so we are busy debating a Bill to make them self-regulatory. On this one, why are we not putting in someone or an umbrella body to regulate NGOs? Every year you have to go and apply for a license. There is no time frame; it is not presumed that once you have applied you continue running, it is not in the book.

So you invest a million dollars, it comes end of the year and you re-apply for your license and they do not answer what do you do? There is no timeline, so you spend your money but you have got no security. No one is going to do that. What is going to happen is that every single NGOs is going to hold their money from where it comes until they need it desperately and that is going to slow down? I would like to reiterate, our medical facilities and our schools are sponsored primarily when it comes to things like medicines and textbooks by PVOs but we ignore that. If we have a problem with one NGO or a PVO with this particular issue, then target it. Why do we have to go to this draconian Bill, make it stronger and pass it here and run it through this Parliament like it is running water? If you compare it to the Financial Adjustments Bill which is now nearly 18 months old, there is no rush to push that $9. 6 billion over expenditure through this House.

Madam Speaker, I had not even touched on the issues of the effect of this Bill. This Bill will reduce donations coming to this country. Whether we like it or not, we need every penny we get. I further want to add; if trustees are pushed out, most of the trustees are the core of communities in this country. They are the core of the communities and if you start messing around with them there is no confidence and we will blame sanctions.

My last point Madam Speaker, where do the family trusts stand because I talk of trusts but let me talk of family trusts? How many tens of thousands and most of us in this House have got some sort of family trusts – how is that affected? The way I read it, I can kick you off if I want. Madam Speaker, there is no way I can remain with the family trust. It is not worth a risk. Whatever I have got, whether it is a house, a car, bicycle, a pair of jeans that are put in the family trust that can be taken away on someone saying it is political or someone saying it is illegitimate or it is immoral. I say this because it is going to affect tens of thousands of Zimbabweans. Madam Speaker, I call desperately for this Bill to be withdrawn. I thank you.

*HON MUCHENJE: Thank you Madam Speaker. I want to add a few words on this particular Bill. My considered view is that it is not a good law. Zimbabwe as a poor country and the state of affairs that we have and hunger, we require aid from outside the country. We cannot stand on our own. We cannot be an island, just like a home; it should not be an island. It is my thinking that if we are talking of home, if there is a dog that is in the habit of cannibalising the chickens, we only deal with that dog cannibalising the chickens and not the entire pack of dogs. I urge the responsible Minister to seriously consider the assistance that comes from the NGOs in schools, hospitals and in needy communities. NGOs assist us. They should weed out bad NGOs and leave the good ones operating. The one size fits all should not be applied. There should be different strokes for different folks. . We should not be serving very few narrow interests to the detriment of the entire nation which will end up suffering. Hon. Minister, we cannot pass this Bill in this form because it hurts us as ordinary people as well as it hurts us as Members of Parliament and those that we represent. It also destroys the development of Zimbabwe. NGOs were going to help in ensuring the development of Zimbabwe. We were receiving inputs such as fertilizers and even pesticides from NGOs and once they are banned there is no help forthcoming. Should there be a drought in this country, they will assist us with food. We therefore urge the Hon. Minister to withdraw this Bill. It does not serve our interests and it is not good for us. I thank you.

THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): Mr. Speaker Sir, I move that the debate do now adjourn.

Motion put and agreed to.

Debate to resume: Tuesday, 18th October, 2022.

MOTION

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): Mr. Speaker Sir, I move that we revert to Order of the Day, Number 13.

Motion put and agreed to.

SECOND READING

INSTITUTE OF LOSS CONTROL AND PRIVATE SECURITY MANAGERS BILL [H.B. 5, 2021]

Thirteenth Order read: Second Reading: Institute of Loss Control and Private Security Managers Bill [H. B. 5, 2021].

Question again proposed.

          HON. DR. MURIRE: Mr. Speaker, I rise to present the second reading of the Institute of Chartered Loss Control and Private Security Management Bill.  This Bill has got a background with the intention to professionally control the operations of private security management. It is the responsibility of the State to provide security to its citizens but world-over States are overwhelmed with that obligation to the extent that they are no longer capable of providing security to citizens wherever and whenever it is required.

It is obvious and certain that private security management has developed to fill in the gaps. If we come to our country, we will see that security in Zimbabwe per se is mainly provided by private entities to the extent that the workforce in private security is now much more than that employed by private security. On that background, I am proud to say it to the House that I am the author of the first curricula of professional security management training in Zimbabwe. That was ten years ago and with that curriculum, security management and loss control is now a profession. We now have people who have graduated with first, masters and PhD degrees in Zimbabwe but there is no professional institution or regulating authority which can monitor their professional performance.

It is on that basis that this Bill has been introduced in this House. I therefore go through the principles of this Bill. The Bill seeks to provide for the establishment of the Institute of Chartered Loss Control and Private Security Managers; to provide for the establishment of a council; to provide for matters connected or incidental to the foregoing. The proposed law introduces professional best practices in loss control and private security management occupations, in particular the individual clauses provided as follows;

Part 1 Clause 1, provides for the short title of the Bill. Clause 2 provides for interpretation of terms used in the Bill. Clause 3 provides for application of the Act and Clause 4 sets the objects of the Bill. Part 2 Clause 6 affords the opportunity for establishment of the Institute of Chartered Loss Control and Private Security Managers which shall be a professional association and a body corporate capable of suing and being sued in its own name. The functions of the Institute are listed in Clause 7 which includes liaising and collaborating with its members in practice, business and employment in accordance with its mandate.

The institute shall be managed and directed by a board known as its Management Council. The Management Council shall consist of 13 members as set out in Clause 9 and shall function in accordance with Clause 9. For the day to day administration of the institute, the Council shall appoint an Executive Secretary who shall be assisted by officers the Council considers necessary as given in Clause 2.

Parts 3 and 4; the registrar of loss control and private security managers and application for registration are provided for in Clauses 12 and 13 of the Bill respectively. While Clauses 14, 15, 16 and 17 provide for the manner in which a person will become a member, annual general meetings, and extraordinary meetings and that the institute shall publish a Code of Conduct that directly addresses the professional conduct of loss control and private security managers.

Mr. Speaker, Parts 5 and 6; Part 5 contains two clauses. Clause 18 provides for the funds of the institute which shall be managed by the Treasurer and subject to audits in terms of Clause 19. Clause 6 contains a reciprocity clause which provides that where any country specified by the Government, by notice in the Gazette prevents citizens and residents of Zimbabwe from becoming members of any institution similar to the institute and subjects them to unfair discrimination in that country; no subject of any such country shall be entitled to become a member of the institute or practice the profession of loss control and management in Zimbabwe under the name of the institute.

Clause 21 provides that the Minister, after consultation with the Council, may make regulations providing for all matters which by this Act are required or permitted to be prescribed or which in his or her own opinion, are necessary or convenient to be prescribed in order to carry out or give effect to this Act. Mr. Speaker, these are the principles.

The framework under which this institute is envisaged to operate is similar to that of the Public Accountants which is a self-regulating body. It is similar to the Institute of Engineers as well as the legal practitioners. This Bill has been presented with sight that private security and loss control is now a profession like I earlier on said. We have got a pool of qualified people who are employed as private security directors, private loss control managers in various organisations including the RBZ, Econet Wireless, ZESA, CBZ and UZ, to name just a few organisations.

I am proud to let the House know that within this profession, we have posted one of our graduates who is now a Chief Security Officer for the Qatar Airline who graduated from institutions that we are operating in Zimbabwe, yet locally there is no professional body to accommodate them. Most of those who are now regarded as professionals are affiliated to international organisations like the Chartered Institute of Security Management in United Kingdom where our members are now affiliated, paying exorbitant fees in foreign currency, the foreign currency which we are very much in need of yet we can have our own local self-regulating professional body.

The two members - currently Mr. Chidyamoto who is internationally renowned as the Chief Security Officer for the Africa Development Bank has graduated from these institutions. He is a Chartered Security Manager affiliated to UK yet we can have our own. I therefore present this Bill for a second reading.

I move that the debate do now adjourn.

Motion put and agreed to.

Debate to resume: Tuesday 18th October, 2022.

MOTION

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

HON. MUTAMBISI: I move that all Orders of the Day be stood over until Order of the Day Number 22 has been disposed of.

HON. L. SIBANDA:  I second.

Motion put and agreed to.

MOTION

REPORT OF THE 60TH SESSION OF THE OACPS PARLIAMENTARY ASSEMBLY AND THE 41ST SESSION OF THE ACP-EU JOINT PARLIAMENTARY ASSEMBLY

          HON. PRISCILLA MOYO: I move the motion standing in my name that this House takes note of the Report of the 60th Session of the OACPS Parliamentary Assembly and the 41st Session of the ACP-EU Joint Parliamentary Assembly.

          HON. MLAMBO: I second.

          HON. PRISCILLA MOYO:  I rise to present a report on the 60th Session of the OACPS Parliamentary Assembly and the 41st Session of the ACP-EU Joint Parliamentary Assembly.

1.0      INTRODUCTION

1.1      The meetings of the 60th Session of the OACPS Parliamentary Assembly and the 41st Session of the ACP-EU Joint Parliamentary Assembly were held in Strasbourg, France from the 29th of March to the 3rd of April 2022. The sessions were of vital importance primarily for two reasons, namely: they were the very first physical congregation of the assemblies since the outbreak of the COVID-19 pandemic and that the Joint Parliamentary Assembly was the last one under the Cotonou Partnership Agreement.

1.2      The following Members and Officers of Parliament participated at the meetings:-

Hon. General (Rtd) Michael R. Nyambuya, Deputy President of the Senate and Head of Delegation;

H.E. Ambassador  Amon Mutembwa

Hon. Priscilla Moyo, Member of Parliament;

Hon. Elias Mudzuri, Member of Parliament;

Mr.  Chiwoneso Mike Mukura, Embassy of Zimbabwe, Brussels.

Ms. Rudo Nellia Elizabeth Doka, Director - External Relations;

Mr. Felix Chidavaenzi, Research Officer; and

Mr. Obvious Muchenu, Security Aide to the Hon. Deputy President of the Senate.

1.3    REMARKS FROM THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR EUROPEAN UNION (EU) AFFAIRS-SIR CLEMENT BEAUNE.

1.3.1 Sir Clement Beaune reaffirmed the EU `s determination to work frantically with ACPs through the creation of an international Agreement to deal with global pandemics like COVID-19.

1.3.2 Noting, Inter-governmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) report on Climate Change, Global South countries will be affected more and to that end, of the EU`s 150 Billion Euros investment, 20% will go towards climate action for sustainable accelerated development in the ACPs.

1.3.3 Importantly, 150 initiatives are being prepared and will be accessed through European Financial institutions by National Development Agencies for mutual benefits.

 

1.4    ADDRESS BY THE CO-PRESIDENTS OF THE ACP-EU JOINT PARLIAMENTARY ASSEMBLY.

1.4.1 Hon Zourinho, the Co-President from the EU, welcomed the President of the OACPs, Hon. Peter Kenilorea (Jnr), from the Solomon Islands and all Members of Parliament to the first physical meeting in two years due to COVID-19. He expressed gratitude to the members for keeping the Joint Parliamentary Assembly active and alive during the trying times imposed by the pandemic. He congratulated the mayor of Strasbourg for her efforts towards the zero waste target and energy transition plan for the beautiful and historical city of Strasbourg and called upon the partnership to condemn Russia for what he referred to, as an invasion of Ukraine which he said was against the ideals of democracy, rule of law, prosperity and peace among others. It is for that reason that the Russian invasion of Ukraine and its global impacts discussion, found its way on the 41st ACP-EU session`s agenda for discussion without resolutions. 

1.4.2 Hon Peter Kenilorea, the Co-President from the OACPS, expressed pleasure to be physically joining colleagues in Strasbourg, France and working with the EU Co-Presidency for the very first time. He expressed his gratitude to the Mayor and French Presidency for offering to host the assemblies at the backdrop of the pandemic, which was no easy decision. He took time to express his deepest condolences on his behalf, and on behalf of the OACPS, on the untimely demise of the European Union President, David Sassoli. The CoPresident reiterated the multiple crisis that were confronting the globe that included climate change and COVID 19, among others, that required working together and Multilaterism towards attainment of Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs). He reminded members of the importance of the ACP-EU JPA in facilitating political diplomacy and facilitating political debates. In concluding, he called upon the EU to sign on the new partnership agreement.

1.5    REMARKS BY DEPUTY MINISTER OF INFORMATION, AND COMMUNICATION TECHNOLOGY, HON EMMA THEOFELUS, REPUBLIC OF NAMIBIA.

1.5.1 Hon Theophilus  noted, in her remarks, that even though great effort was being applied in including the gender dimension to various strategic priority areas and development, it fell far short of the required.

1.5.2 Furthermore, the current form of the partnership does not address youth concerns fully.

2.0    STATEMENT BY JUTTA URPILAINEN, Member of the Commission with responsibility for international partnerships.

2.1      Commissioner Urpilainen made a statement and a lively debate with members around topical issues in the fold of the Post Cotonou Partnership Agreement, the Russian – Ukraine war, The global Gateway, Climate Change and food security among others.

2.2      She highlighted the team Europe initiative to strengthen manufacturing of vaccines to the tune of 1 billion Euros in Africa and the creation of three to four regional hubs on the continent to produce vaccines with the ultimate goal of strengthening basic health care systems in partner countries and Africa.  More than 30 billion Euros was pledged for the ACP states with three billion Euros to be set aside for Covac. Ten percent of the funding, she said, will be committed to migration and the priority will be to address the root causes of migration in terms of governance and border controls.

2.3      The global vaccination strategy where 1 billion Euros would be spent on upgrading systems, training and ensuring capacity of transporting and equitable distribution of vaccines was emphasised.

2.4      It was her sincere hope that the Post-Cotonou Agreement would be ratified as soon as possible.

3.0      THE GLOBAL IMPACTS OF THE RUSSIAN-UKRAINIAN CRISIS INCLUDES THE FOLLOWING:

3.1      Massive destruction of property, loss of precious lives and many people injured physically and emotionally among other ills.

3.2      The blocking of wheat exports from Russia and Ukraine, impacts negatively on food security in African countries dependent on the two countries for supplies.

3.3      Ultimately, refugees not seen since World War 2, particularly students, women, children as well as the disabled need to be hosted in neighbouring Europe.

3.4      The energy and gas situation will worsen in countries dependent on Russia for these commodities, particularly in the whole of Europe.

3.5      In the process, billions of dollars will be lost directly and indirectly in the war and its impacts.       

3.6      In expressing his deep concern over the Russian-Ukraine crisis, Retired. General Michael R. Nyambuya pointed out that there is no outright winner in any war and as such, should be avoided at all costs.

3.7      He urged parties involved to find each other through peaceful means as enshrined in the United Nations Charter with dialogue being the only way forward.

3.8      Hon. Nyambuya made reference to over 20 years of Zimbabwe’s victimization through the use of unilateral cohesive measures like the sanctions and noted that sanctions cause untold suffering to the ordinary person and ultimately result in humanitarian crisis.

3.9      A clarion call was made to the International community not to further complicate the already complex situation but rather aid in finding durable solutions through peaceful settlement of disputes.

4.0      URGENT TOPIC ON THREATS TO STABILITY AND SECURITY IN THE WESTERN AND SAHELIAN AFRICA.

4.1      Members were concerned as to why that region continues in that sorry trajectory without an ending. Many ACP countries appealed to the EU countries to be part of the solution and not the problem.

4.2      Honourable Retired. General Michael R. Nyambuya made a critical intervention on the urgent topic, which attracted a lot of admiration from peers.

4.3      He unpacked the plethora of threats to peace, security and stability in Western and Sahelian Africa in the fold of trans-boundary criminal activities, organized crimes as well as democracy deficits among others.

4.4      He highlighted how COVID-19, the impact of climate change and religious extremism compounded the situation in the region under discussion. In conclusion, noting historical and economic links in the ACP-EU partnership, the retired General called for multilateral collaborations and cooperation between organizations for symbiotic benefit.

4.5      The Hon. Deputy President of the Senate and Head of the Zimbabwean delegation, Retired. General Michael R. Nyambuya, received a standing ovation from colleagues when he boldly registered his dismay at the failure by ACP states to utilize regional bodies like ECOWAS to decisively tackle challenges and harness opportunities for development.

5.0      URGENT TOPIC ON OVERCOMING THE GLOBAL COVID 19 PANDEMIC: COOPERATION FOR ECONOMIC RECOVERY AND INVESTMENTS TO ACHIEVE UNIVERSAL HEALTH COVERAGE.

5.1      Jakkie Cilliers, Head of African Futures and Innovation Institute for Security Studies in Pretoria, South Africa gave a presentation on the subject matter and the major take home points included the following:

5.2      Impact of COVID-19 on Gross Domestic Product (GDP) per capita (PPP) are such that Recovery to 2019 average incomes are likely to be attained in 2024.

5.3      Consequently, Africa has a larger disease burden than other continents, particularly malaria and zoonotic pathogens such as HIV and hence COVID-19 is no exception.

5.4      More so, modern medicine allows urbanization in Africa without the associated basic infrastructure and this translates to a large Water, Sanitation and Hygiene (WASH) deficit.

5.5      Given that Africa is rapidly approaching its epidemiological transition, chronic diseases will consequently substitute communicable diseases as the prominent cause of death and escalate health costs.

5.6      The Zimbabwean delegation position on the subject matter resonated well with all those speakers that related with the notion that COVID-19 had resulted in devastating socio, economic, political and cultural consequences.

5.7      Accordingly, the virus respects no political boundaries, race and religion. While Universal Health coverage is noble as alluded to by many European representatives, for many ACP countries the priority is just to provide their people with basic health care.

5.8      The Zimbabwean delegation fully subscribes to the notion that vaccination is the only sustainable way out of the pandemic but is concerned about the obtaining realities of vaccine nationalization and vaccine discrimination.

5.9      To that end, Hon. Nyambuya called for the world to set aside their parochial differences for the common good. 

6.0      A huge section of the European community was of the notion that people in the ACP were refusing to take up vaccination, a position disputed by the ACP countries.

7.0      RECOMMENDATIONS ARISING FROM THE MEETING (S).

7.1      The European community and a few others sympathetic to Ukraine are of the opinion that Russia must stop the aggression and leave the Ukrainian territory as a matter of urgency and without conditions. They further requested everyone and in particular the ACP to condemn Russia in the greatest terms and support Ukraine with resources to continue defending herself as long as she has the willpower to continue fighting.

7.2      Friends to Russia, including many ACP countries, recommended peaceful means to settlement of the dispute, as enshrined in the United Nations Charter. They also advocated for non-imposition of unilateral cohesive measures like sanctions on anyone. The position for the ACP was reached at the OACPS meetings.

7.3      ACP states implored the EU to consult with them before declaring any sanctions which ultimately impact negatively on the ACP. To that end, the expectation now is that Europe should invest in the ACP to cushion them against the impacts. Furthermore, the ACP expects a shift in the migration policy.

7.4      European tertiary institutions were called upon to accommodate the displaced ACP students from Ukraine without discrimination or favour.

7.5      As a way forward, a clarion call was made for efficient and more equitable vaccine production, distribution and an end to vaccine discrimination as a sure way to fight and recover from the pandemic.

 7.6     The Retired General challenged peers to take advantage of the vast resources in the OACPS and not just look up to the West for solutions. He highlighted that Zimbabwe`s continued involvement in ensuring peace and stability through physical interventions in countries in distress depended to a greater extent on the unconditional lifting of the illegal sanctions imposed by America and her allies.

7.7      Integrated urban planning including dealing with WASH backlog in informal and slum areas must be prioritized.

7.8      Development and updating of national pandemic preparedness planning must be prioritized and to that end, the Portfolio Committee on Local government must take stock of our own disaster and risk reduction (DRR) architecture by the 30th of August 2022. 

7.9      International cooperation including on international patent regimes and solidarity to address the Global education crisis in the wake of the COVID-19 Pandemic must take centre stage.   

 8.0     RESOLUTIONS

8.1      National testing and vaccine manufacturing capacities, particularly in the ACP countries, must be enhanced as a matter of urgency. To that end, our portfolio committee on Health and childcare may need to check the feasibility of that route and operationalise the plan in the pipeline by 31 August 2022.

8.2      Activation of Coordinated incident management and response systems in the partnership.

8.3      The multilateral system be mutually beneficial to all Member States in the partnership.

8.4      Regarding the OACPS – EU Partnership Agreement, The transition from COTONOU Agreement to the POST COTONOU Agreement must happen with the proposed signing scheduled at the end of July 2022.

8.5      The youth amplified the recommendation that the youth assembly as well as the women`s assembly be conscripted into the formalized structures of the JPA like other major organizations, a position which is in tandem with Zimbabwe’s vision.

8.6      Noting the successful conclusion of the crafting, negotiation and adoption of the post Cotonou Agreement, Member States are expected to ensure that the Rules of Procedure are brought to finality as soon as possible, followed by ratification.

8.7      To conclude the sessions, the ACP-EU Members enthusiastically debated and voted on 58 series of Motions for resolutions on “Enhancing the Resilience of Small Island Developing States (SIDS) against Climate Change and Natural Disasters”.

8.8      Calls on governments to use rebuilding after a natural disaster as an opportunity to adjust their models in a bid to make their societies and their construction practices more sustainable and environmentally friendly, achieve energy autonomy for SIDS based on renewable marine and terrestrial energies, secure food autonomy to overcome the problem of dependence on imports, as well as water autonomy with more efficient water management through the recovery and reuse thereof; To this end, it is prudent for joint committees of Local Government and that of Environment, Climate and Tourism to review how the climate induced disasters are being handled in the country by end of September 2022.

8.9      Stress also on the need for better waste management, especially in coastal areas, which are of strategic significance for the passage of waste from land to sea in SIDS. Jointly, our portfolio committees on Environment, Climate and Tourism and that of Local government must build on their earlier work around waste management in the country towards efficient, sustainable waste management systems by 30 November 2022.

8.10    Highlights the critical role of civil society in harnessing public opinion and state action; calls on the EU and ACP states to engage and include non-state actors, who are front runners in the fight against climate change.

10.0    CONCLUSION

10.1    Co-President Zourinho informed delegates that Southern Africa would host the 42nd ACP-EU Joint Parliamentary Assembly in Mozambique. The dates for the meetings will be communicated in due course. I thank you. 

HON RAIDZA: Thank you Mr. Speaker Sir, for giving me the opportunity to debate on the motion that was moved by Hon Moyo in relation to the visit that they undertook to France about the 60th Session of OACPS Parliamentary Assembly and the 41st Session of the ACP-EU Joint Parliamentary Assembly. From the report, there are a number of issues that were discussed at these very important meetings.

To start with, I want to discuss issues around waste management. From the report that we got, we heard that many of the people who went there were of the view that waste management is a very key issue that many of our local authorities in the member States were supposed to take very seriously. If we come back home here in Zimbabwe, we are battling so much with the issues of waste management. If you move around here in Harare, you see a very disturbing trend of waste that is lying all over in the city. We used to know Harare as a sunshine city but since the turn of the millennium, we are now seeing dirt all over. We are seeing dirt all over despite the fact that we have elected officials and employees in these city councils. At the end of the day, there is no much work that is being done.

From the report that we got, the delegates to this meeting congratulated the Mayor of Strasbourg for her efforts towards the zero waste target and energy transition plan for the beautiful and historical City of Strasbourg. What we are lacking in this country is a plan. We are not hearing what plans are our local authorities having in terms of their waste management. Recently, we heard about the Pomona deal. From the presentation that we have been hearing and reading.  These were some of the efforts that those who were innovative were trying to bring to City of Harare. Unfortunately, because of personal interests and conflicts, we are hearing that this deal must not go ahead. The City Fathers want to continue seeing waste that is not being collected. I believe that this deal needs to be given an opportunity and then after that, we can do our evaluation as a country to see whether this kind of model can help us or not. For us to throw away every innovation that is proposed to us, I think it is not right.

(v)HON S. BANDA: On a point of order Mr. Speaker. My point of order is that the Hon. Member is misrepresenting the House. The City Fathers are not against a deal that is done properly. They actually want Pomona to be turned into a waste generation facility which provides electricity. To say that they are not doing that is very wrong. I want the Hon. Member to withdraw that.

THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER: The point of order is overruled. If you have got any objection to what is being said, I will give you the floor to counter the point he has raised.

HON RAIDZA: My issue is all about innovations to say if someone brings up an innovation that we think can improve our waste management in this country, I think we need to give it an opportunity for it to see the light of the day because currently if you move around all our municipalities and cities, we realise that we are moving backwards.

The other issue that I wanted to talk about is the discussion that was around COVID-19 investments. In this meeting, the delegates really debated at length to say many of our African countries need to put some money aside or invest in manufacturing companies that can help us in times of need like what happened during the pandemic. We realised that during COVID-19, us as African countries were not having easy access to these critical vaccines that would be helping our nations. In this meeting, many of our ACP countries were encouraged to look into how best to prepare and invest in such type of manufacturing companies.

Regarding the issue of climate change, climate change is real and many of our countries need to take this issue very seriously and come up with mitigation factors to make sure that we are not caught unaware and some of the effects of climate change will not really take a toll on our people. I believe that if we look at some of the programmes that we are doing in this country like Pfumvudza, it is a programme that was introduced by His Excellency Dr E. D. Mnangagwa as a climate proofing mechanism in terms of our farming. We know that we are no longer having reliable rainfalls. It is very difficult for us to always have productive seasons all the time and that is why we ended up having Pfumvudza. I want to applaud our Government for being proactive when it comes to some of these issues that will end up affecting our people.

On the issue of Russia/Ukraine war, I liked the recommendation from the leader of our delegation Hon. Sen. Major General (Rtd.). Nyambuya. Hon. Sen. Nyambuya in that meeting recommended what we call peaceful settlement between the warring parties. He went further to say that when there is a war, no one comes out as a winner in most instances but the lives of the general populace get disturbed during the war. I like and I want to support the idea that was proposed by the leader of our delegation that the two nations are supposed to find a peaceful settlement rather than the views that were being proposed by those who were supporting Ukraine when they were saying they would rather look for more ammunition to support Ukraine so that they remain fighting. If these two nations remain at war, it is the general populace that will suffer.

Another issue that Hon. Sen. Nyambuya talked about is the issue of sanctions which were placed upon Russia by European countries that it was not necessary because those sanctions were hurting the ordinary people in Russia, like what is happening in our nation here in Zimbabwe.  We know the effects of sanctions because many of our people at times think that the sanctions that are on our country are targeted sanctions.  However, the results   on the ground reflect otherwise. Really, these sanctions are not targeted but they are sanctions against the country of Zimbabwe.  That is why the moment we start talking about sanctions we realise that these sanctions were placed upon our leaders.  They were placed upon key industries of this country.  Even ordinary business people cannot have access to any foreign funding or any capital for them to do their business because Zimbabwe is regarded as a high risk country due to these sanctions.

          By that alone, we can realise that these sanctions are not targeted at individuals because they are not affecting individuals.  They are affecting our industries, the general populace and they are affecting people even from Mberengwa East there.  Those people get the feel of these sanctions.  That is why Gen. Nyambuya was strongly against the imposition of sanctions. By imposing sanctions, you are directly attacking the sovereignty of each and every nation.

          The last point is on the youth issues.  This point was raised by the Minister from Namibia, where he encouraged the Assembly that they must take youths in all its structures and in all its processes because we know that if we move with our youths, it means for posterity we will be guaranteed that our nation will continue to move forward. So I want to support the observations and recommendations that came from this meeting and the recommendations made by the delegation that went for this meeting.  Our Local Government Portfolio Committee and our Environment Portfolio Committee need to really take these issues very seriously as the recommendations will help our nation as we are to move towards Vision 2030.  I thank you.

          (v) HON. T. MLISWA: On a point of order Mr. Speaker Sir.  I pleaded and I am aware I have to close my debate today.  Can I be accommodated to just close my debate and thank everybody; the APNAC one.  It cannot carry over to the next Session.  So I am asking whether the Chief Whips are there? Handiko, saka ndoita sei? Ndobhururuka here, ivo ngavandi taurirevo kuti vachandipa mukana, kungo closer chete ndotenda vanhu.  Saka imhosva here?

          (v) HON. S. BANDA: Thank you Mr. Speaker for giving me the floor to contribute to this debate.  Firstly, allow me to thank the Parliament of Zimbabwe and the Government of Zimbabwe for allowing our Parliamentary team to go to the ACP-EU meeting.  I support the resolutions that they have come up with, particularly the one on CSOs.  CSOs bring relief, laughter, resources, goodness, fundraising, grants, things that may be the country may not get without them.  So, I trust that this very resolution also appeals to the Private Voluntary Organisations Bill, which we will of course debate another day.  This is what exactly is being discussed here that we should not let some organisations suffer.  We should make them to be there so that they can do important work for the nation.

          I now move on to the issues of gender and youth representation.  The call being made here is something that we appreciate the most.  I also want to thank that the reforms being proposed, we are going to have more women and youth councilors wherein we are going to have more youths and women representative even in Parliament.  That is something that is highly appreciated and I want to thank them for that.  What was not really clear is on climate change.  How much is coming to Zimbabwe?  They are saying that about 20% will be going towards poor nations, developing nations, islands, et cetera. How much of that amount is coming to Zimbabwe?  How are we going to utilise it so that we run away from effects of climate change which have destroyed agriculture, which have made agriculture to have regressive development?  This is an opportune moment for Zimbabwe to also partake and receive things that are straight forward.  Now, here is the question - Zimbabwe may not be able to receive some of these funds, because we are on the sanctions list.

 Some of the issues that are required are dialogue within this country.  We are talking of dialogue in Russia; between Russia and Ukraine yet in Zimbabwe, Opposition and the Government do not see eye to eye.  So I want to thank the Deputy President of the Senate for what he has come up with.  This dialogue should not just happen in Russia and Ukraine.  Let it begin at home, let us talk.  Let us dialogue.  When we go into next year, let us do electoral reforms so that elections can be fair both sides, so that when we go in, we do not go in as enemies because we are not enemies.  We may differ but what we are is, we are Zimbabweans.  Let us love one another.  Let us prepare for a peaceful election…

          HON. RAIDZA: On a point of order. I just wanted to remind Hon. Banda that His Excellency, our President Dr. E. D. Mnangagwa has established together with other Opposition leaders what is known as POLAD in this country as a way of bringing all political parties together for them to have dialogue that can take this country forward.  So when he is saying there is no platform for political parties, I am failing to understand the debate from the Hon. Member. 

          (v) HON. S. BANDA: Thank you Mr. Speaker Sir.  Allow me to answer my good friend, Hon. Raidza on that. While we appreciate POLAD, we realise that there are other members who are not within POLAD.  So at the end of the day, the dialogue that is going to be there is limited.  We want a dialogue that encompasses everyone, be it churches, youths and women. I just want to thank Hon. Priscilla Moyo for the fruitful report and the fruitful discussion that they had at that Forum.  I hope that the next one that is in Mozambique will also clarify how much will come in to South African nations so that climate changes do not affect us a lot. 

          HON. PRISCILLA MOYO:  I move that the debate do now adjourn. 

          HON. L. SIBANDA:  I second.

          Motion put and agreed to.

          Debate to resume:  Tuesday, 18th October, 2022.

ANNOUNCEMENTS BY THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER

CUSTOMER SATISFACTION SURVEY

          THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER (HON. MUTOMBA):  I have to inform the House that Parliament of Zimbabwe is currently conducting a customer satisfaction survey.  Head Hunters International was engaged to conduct the said survey on behalf of Parliament. The main objective of the survey is to solicit for feedback from all key stakeholders with regard to service delivery so that Parliament continuously improves processes to meet stakeholders’ requirements.  In this regard, all Hon. Members are kindly requested to cooperate during the said exercise.  Consultants from Head Hunters International will be administering questionnaires in the Members Dining during sitting days and at the Pre-Budget Seminar.

PRE-BUDGET BRIEFING SEMINAR

          THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER:  I wish to remind Hon. Members that there will be a Pre-Budget Briefing Seminar on Monday, 17th October, 2022 at the Rainbow Towers Hotel, Harare in the Main Auditorium. 

          HON. DR. MURIRE:  Thank you Mr. Speaker Sir.  I did not understand the Parliament customer satisfaction survey.  Is it customer satisfaction on the service to Parliamentarians or it is customer satisfaction survey for the service to the public?  If it is to the public, is it going to be administered outside?  I did not understand the whole gist of the survey for clarification Mr. Speaker Sir. 

          THE TEMPORARY SPEAKER:  Thank you very much Hon. Murire.  This exercise is all about service delivery by Parliament.  Thank you. 

MOTION

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

          HON. MUTAMBISI:  Thank you Mr. Speaker.  I move that all Orders of the Day on today’s Order Paper be stood over until Order of the Day, Number 30 has been disposed of.

          HON. RAIDZA:  I second.

          Motion put and agreed to. 

MOTION

FIRST REPORT OF THE AFRICAN PARLIAMENTARY NETWORK AGAINST CORRUPTION (APNAC) ON THE BENCHMARKING VISIT TO KENYA

          Thirtieth Order read:  Adjourned debate on motion on the Report of the African Parliamentary Network Against Corruption (APNAC) on the benchmarking visit to Kenya.

          Question again proposed.

          *HON. MUTAMBISI:  Thank you Mr. Speaker for affording me this opportunity to also add my voice on the benchmarking visit made to Kenya on this cancerous practice called corruption.  Those that spoke before me indicated that corruption is abhorrent.  I would want to thank the leader of the Zimbabwean Government, H.E. Cde. E.D. Mnangagwa who is at the forefront in the fight against corruption. This is shown by organisations that ensure that those that are involved in corrupt practices are dealt with.  Corruption tendencies are detrimental to our country. 

          In Kenya, we met several organisations and none would want corruption to be encouraged.  In fact, they are in full force fighting against it.  In Zimbabwe, we have different political organisations.  Political organisations in Kenya are standing together as one to put an end to corruption.  Political will is needed among the political parties that we speak with one voice and we fight on the same front because we have a leader who does not condone corruption.  I have earlier on pointed out that the Anti-Corruption Commission was put in place.  Furthermore, we should put an end to corruption and it should start from the schools.  In schools, we should have a curriculum that abhors corruption.  We need to tame them young and it will not become difficult when they become adults because they know that being involved in corruption can lead to incarceration.  I thank you Mr. Speaker Sir. 

          *HON. MAVETERA:  I thank you Hon. Speaker and I would like to thank those that brought in this report.  Usually people travel out of the country on a fact finding visit to see what other countries are doing to fight corruption, but we do not get feedback. That is why I would like to thank those that went to Kenya on a fact finding visit.  I want to thank His Excellency the President of Zimbabwe because he always discourages corruption.  In 2019, APNAC did a commemoration for anti-corruption day which is commemorated every 9th day of December.  In 2019, the President of Zimbabwe talked to the people of APNAC and I remember what the President said when we were discussing about the catch and release situation.  The President said we must put in place a whistleblower protection so that all people who go and report will be protected.  The other cases are that the courts do not find enough evidence to prosecute and they will end of up releasing the accused persons. 

          There is no country that promotes corruption but what happens is that when it comes to the issue of corruption, it depends on the individual not as a country.  It does not mean that when one person who belongs to a certain political party engages in corrupt activities, then we say the whole party is corrupt.  Let us tackle corruption individually. It does not mean if you are from a certain church or place, so everyone from there will be labeled.  Let us desist from pointing fingers but let us be responsible individuals because the moment we blame a certain sector or type of people, we bring enmity amongst people.  It does not matter what church one goes to, the political party they belong to, the type or marriage they are in, or whether they are married or not; that is not it when it comes to corruption issues.  Corruption is done individually; any person can engage in corruption despite the fact that they are from a certain political party. 

          There is no school of corruption and I want to say this Hon. Speaker, corruption especially we the youth are totally against it and nobody likes or supports corruption.  I want to thank our President Cde. E. D. Mnangagwa for not supporting corrupt activities.   I say that whoever engages in corruption must be prosecuted. 

Let me end up by saying if a person is prosecuted for stealing a phone, that phone is not seen by the judge but the person is sentenced.  When both the accused and the complainant go to court, sometimes it depends on who will have facts to defend his or her case wisely.  No one will have seen the phone in the courts but it is the words of the accused against the complainant.   On corruption, why do we say we do not have evidence to prove that the person engaged in acts of corruption?   For our country to go forward, we must discourage corrupt activities.  As youths, it is our desire that we grow up in a corruption free country.  We do not support corruption at all and all those that are involved in corrupt activities must be prosecuted.

          <HON. DR. MURIRE: Thank you Mr. Speaker.  I rise to add my voice to this motion. Corruption is a bad practice, corruption has destroyed our country and in everything that we do, if corruption is involved, whether in private or Government sectors, such practice is bad and detrimental to the development of our country.  We are mourning about the imposition of sanctions and if we add corruption, it is like coming from the frying pan right into the fire. 

          I would also want to further state that if we are talking about corruption, it is quite difficult that if someone is arrested and appears before a court and is remanded in custody for two weeks and later to be found out that the person is innocent.  I would want to say that I was once arrested on corruption charges and I was later discharged.  Most of the times there may not be substantial evidence.  Even if you free that person, the media and the people will have known that someone has been arrested for corruption.  The names of the people will be tarnished. 

          I urge the Government and the police that all those who investigate corruption must be fully capacitated on how to deal with corruption issues so that they will not be the phrase ‘catch and release’. This is now putting the Government and police in bad light. In the public domain, they will then say that he committed an offence and was released.  The truth is that the person was released because he was innocent.  People would want to find out why there was an arrest in the first place. If ZACC and police are given adequate training in dealing with investigations, by the time they make an arrest, they must have sufficient information to prosecute and if the perpetrators appear before the courts, there will be enough evidence to prosecute.  You can only be arrested after investigations by the police. They should not be arresting in order to make investigations. They should first carry out investigations by the matter of lifestyle, the manner one behaves - it is so easy to get to know what corruption is all about. It takes two to tango. Corruption requires two people. For example, you can say so and so is having a love affair with someone’s wife, but if you do not have concrete evidence, then there is nothing to show. If you are a man, you many end up shooting yourself because you would not have found anything. They should be properly schooled if it is the police and ZACC in terms of how they carry out investigations of corrupt cases so that our image will not be spoilt and that we do not become the leading country on the most corrupt countries list.

When you go to the prisons, there are no numerous inmates that have been convicted but there are just three persons that had been arrested on petty cases. A lot of these big names are published in newspapers as being corrupt but they are not in prison. As a country, it is important that we ensure that our police are capacitated to be able to deal with how they can investigate corruption cases in Government departments, Government ministries and in the private sector. There should be people knowledgeable in dealing with fraud cases or corruption. That is what I thought I would add my voice to Mr. Speaker Sir. I thank you for the opportunity that you have granted me.

 (v)*HON. S. BANDA: Thank you Madam Speaker. I would like to thank Hon. Mliswa for the motion he has brought to the august House, a motion on corruption. We are all aware of the rampant corruption taking place in the country. I would like to thank all those that are fighting corruption especially in this House. I would like to thank Shumba Murambwi, Hon. Temba Mliswa; Hon. Rusty Markham; Hon. Mushoriwa and Hon. Biti for fighting corruption. I also thank you Madam Speaker for your fight against corruption. I thank you.

(v)HON. T. MLISWA: I want to thank the Speaker of Parliament for giving us an opportunity to go to other countries on a benchmarking exercise to understand the issues when we debate. I thank all the Members of Parliament who contributed to this. It means a lot and I think we know what we have to do. A corruption robs us all and we must be involved and play a part in our small way. The President is very clear about zero tolerance on corruption. Once he sets a tone, we must follow suit – [Technical glitch.] – I therefore move for the adoption of the motion:

Motion that this House takes note of the First Report of the African Parliamentary Network Against Corruption (APNAC) on the Benchmarking visit to Kenya,   put and agreed to.

On the motion of HON. MUTAMBISI, seconded by HON. S. MAHLANGU, the House adjourned at Five o’clock p. m. until Tuesday, 18th October, 2022.

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